Civil Enforcement Ltd. - Count Court Business Centre Claim Form Received

squimdogmillionaire

Hi all,

I am doing this on behalf of a friend but have familiarised myself with all the details and am going to do the defence etc for them online.

Original ticket from CEL was received we think in April but they were being sent to parents house as that is where the car is registered. Long story short a few of the various letters/warnings had been received by the time he became aware that he had even got a ticket. They ended up just ignoring and ripping them up! As a result the actual details of the case are not clear to me and he can't remember much. Have now received this County Court Business Centre Claim Form which they figured they would have to take a bit more seriously!

Following the newbies thread we have acknowledged the claim online using the guideline dropbox pdf so that is done, and the defence deadline is mid-February.

Details I am aware of are:

It was a pay and display car park (car park was under a Debenhams but I don't think it's run by Debenhams themselves)

He bought a ticket for an hour and estimates that he was 10-15 minutes over this time

Again 'can't remember' the original charge but we think it was £90 or £100.

The claim is for a total of £268.97, broken down into:
debt+damages+8% interest - £193.97
Court fee - £25
Legal representative's costs - £50

So my key questions at this stage are:

Is there a way to get copies of the various letters and warnings that they received? Or just a direct way to get all the relevant info/pics from CEL?

My understanding from reading on here is that if he was 15 minutes or less over the amount he paid for, then this is within the limits of the 'grace period'. If this is correct should this be the central part of the defence?

If this turns out not to be the case and he was over the time by a significant amount what are the other avenues to explore?

As a general enquiry surely the amount being asked for is way over the top regardless of fault? All the aspects seem overblown, £182 seems excessive with 8% interest thrown on top too, legal costs I imagine is not true as I assume they've been sending standard letters, is the court fee a standard amount?

Thanks so much in advance for any advice received, and any more info you need I'll try my best to provide!

Redx

the keeper (defendant) sends the PPC DPO a SAR by email asap, to get all their data, but this may not arrive by the deadline date

what is the DATE OF ISSUE on the claim form ?

the defence will be emailed once completed, not done "online"

the additional costs will be objected to in the defence and the WS too

Umkomaas posted the actual charges in another thread on here today, please read it

Coupon-mad

Is there a way to get copies of the various letters and warnings that they received? Or just a direct way to get all the relevant info/pics from CEL?

SAR - email it right now, to their DPO contact on their privacy page - as explained in the 2nd post of the NEWBIES thread, all about this stage and how to acknowledge the claim and defend.

squimdogmillionaire

Sorry had scrolled past the SAR as thought we were now past that, will email immediately, thanks.

The date of issue is 14/1/18

KeithP

squimdogmillionaire wrote: »

The date of issue is 14/1/18

With a Claim Issue Date of 14th January, and having done the Acknowledgement of Service in a timely manner, you have until 4pm on Monday 18th February 2019 to file your Defence.

That's four weeks away. Loads of time to produce a perfect Defence, but don't leave it to the very last minute.


When you are happy with the content, your Defence should be filed via email as suggested here:

Print your Defence.
1. Sign it and date it.
   
2. Scan the signed document back in and save it as a pdf.
   
3. Send that pdf as an email attachment to CCBCAQ@Justice.gov.uk
   
4. Just put the claim number and the word Defence in the email title, and in the body of the email something like 'Please find my Defence attached'.
   
5. Log into MCOL after a few days to see if the Claim is marked "defended". If not chase the CCBC until it is.
   
6. Do not be surprised to receive a copy of the Claimant's Directions Questionnaire, they are just trying to put you under pressure.
   
7. Wait for your DQ from the CCBC, or download one from the internet, and then re-read post #2 of the NEWBIES FAQ sticky thread to find out exactly what to do with it.

The_Deep

£269 is far more than the Law allows for this sort of claim. The down market solicitors whom the PPCs engage know this, but, because they are solicitors, know that a lot of people will pay up.

It is in fact double charging and non claimable debt collectors' add ons. Imo, this is fraud, or, at the very least, improper conduct.

Were this to get to court and they won, the judge would be unlikely to award the claimant more than £175 - £200.

I urge you to report this grubby law firm to their regulatory body, the SRA.

https://www.sra.org.uk/solicitors/handbook/code/content.page

as I am sure they do not condone this conduct.


The whole industry is a scam, relying on threats of court, and public ignorance of the Law, A bill is currently before parliament which will regulate the scammers, many of whom are ex-clampers.

Hopefully that will take place in the near future. The Bill has passed through the HOC without hitch, and goes to the Lords soon. In the meantime involve your MP, the poor dears are buckling under the weight of complaints about these scammers.

This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of alleged contracts for alleged parking offences, aided and abetted by a handful of low-rent solicitors. Is has been suggested by an MP that some of these companies may have connections to organised crime.

Parking Eye, CPM, Smart, (especially Smart}, and others have already been named and shamed in the House of Commons as have Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (these two law firms take hundreds of these cases to court each week), hospital car parks and residential complex tickets have been especially mentioned. They lose most of them, and have been reported to the regulatory authority by an M.P. for unprofessional conduct

The problem has become so widespread that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers.

Sir Greg Knight's Private Members Bill to curb the excesses, and perhaps close down, some of these companies passed its Third Reading in late November, and, with a fair wind, will become Law next year.

All three readings are available to watch on the internet, (some 6-7 hours), and published in Hansard. MPs have an extremely low opinion of the industry. Many are complaining that they are becoming overwhelmed by complaints from members of the public. Add to their burden, complain in the most robust terms about the scammers.

squimdogmillionaire

Thanks for the replies, I had the deadline worked out as 16/2 but regardless will get it done before then.

I have sent the SAR so I guess will have to wait for them to respond, if they don't get back to me before the deadline what are my options? As I can't reasonably defend the claim with the current amount of info I have.

Regarding reporting to the SRA, the only company I am aware of being involved here is CEL themselves, are they even a law firm?

Otherwise I will update when I get a defence drafted, thanks again for all replies.

The_Deep

My mistake. However, I note that they are asking for £50 for legal representation, ask them for a copy of the v.a.t. invoice. If the refuse complain to Revenue & Customs.

KeithP

squimdogmillionaire wrote: »

I had the deadline worked out as 16/2 but regardless will get it done before then.

Yes, but as 16th February is a Saturday, a non-working day, you are allowed until 4pm on the next working day to file your Defence.

But I agree, you really should aim to have it filed before that weekend.

squimdogmillionaire

Hi again -

I have waited until as long as possible for a reply to my SAR, but have not received a response. I cannot really write any kind of proper defence when I don't have the evidence, so what route should I now go down?

KeithP

squimdogmillionaire wrote: »

I have waited until as long as possible for a reply to my SAR, but have not received a response. I cannot really write any kind of proper defence when I don't have the evidence, so what route should I now go down?

You must file your Defence by 4pm on Monday.

Show the draft you have written.
Having had four weeks to write it, it must be pretty good already.

Of course you can write a Defence without the response to a SAR.

Surely you have read the many Defence example linked from post #2 of the NEWBIES FAQ sticky thread - including Bargepole's concise Defences?

If you are struggling for it, there's a link to that thread in my earlier post.