Brexit the economy and house prices part 7: Brexit Harder

Tromking

Herzlos wrote: »

Am I incorrect or do you just not like my answer?

How do you propose interacting with people who still trot out lies after multiple debunkings? I guess the correct answer is that you don't.

In order for me to worry about the perceived untruths of Leave, you need first to acknowledge the undoubted howlers committed by the Remain side I would suggest.
Only fair eh?
Bitter tropes like “post factual argument” maybe a useful vent for your ongoing anger but they don’t mean anything tangible.

peterbaker

Tromking wrote: »

In order for me to worry about the perceived untruths of Leave, you need first to acknowledge the undoubted howlers committed by the Remain side I would suggest.
Only fair eh?
Bitter tropes like “post factual argument” maybe a useful vent for your ongoing anger but they don’t mean anything tangible.

People in glasshouses shouldn't throw stones, Tromking, especially not every time they post.

phillw

Rinoa wrote: »

Remainer interviewer employed by remainer organization attempts to discredit Brexit supporter.

Brexit supporters discredit themselves.

Tromking wrote: »

In order for me to worry about the perceived untruths of Leave, you need first to acknowledge the undoubted howlers committed by the Remain side I would suggest.
Only fair eh?

Right, like if your wife catches you in bed with the au pair and you argue that she should apologize for not ironing your trousers the way you like them last week. Both annoying and both equal right?

Herzlos

Tromking wrote: »

In order for me to worry about the perceived untruths of Leave, you need first to acknowledge the undoubted howlers committed by the Remain side I would suggest.
Only fair eh?
Bitter tropes like “post factual argument” maybe a useful vent for your ongoing anger but they don’t mean anything tangible.

What remain howlers? There were some predictions that didn't turn out to be accurate, and some misquoting about world war 3. I don't think they come close to the leave campaign.

I meant more that it's emotive - people have seen all the facts and some want brexit despite them. Some are happy for their lives to be made worse to get their brexit. There's not really anything you can do to convince people like that otherwise.

phillw

Herzlos wrote: »

Some are happy for their lives to be made worse to get their brexit. There's not really anything you can do to convince people like that otherwise.

I'm not sure they want their lives to get worse.

It's like smokers who don't want to die from lung cancer, but refuse to give up smoking.

Smokers moan about how annoying non smokers are, like leavers moan about how annoying remainers are.

Because of a feeling of entitlement to be completely free to give yourself and those around you cancer.

Smokers also get upset when experts explain facts to them.

buglawton wrote: »

Marr to Farage:
"You said you admired Putin"
Farage: "I said I admired the way he operated, and that I didn't admire him as a human being".

Marr had a stupid 'I've been caught out' grin on his face for quite some seconds.

What way is putin operating other than as a human being?

Everything Farage says is meaningless twaddle. It's just soundbites to sound good with no substance. He is a traitor to this country.


The storyville brexit behind closed doors is very interesting, I wish the uk had granted similar access. EU politicians are so much better than ours.

Tromking

So, just to get this right.
Remain deal in facts that suddenly morph into mere inaccurate predictions if they’re wrong and Leave are just liars?
Look, this whole business is as it’s always been, an exercise in democracy that requires of its a participants a judgment call.
Speaking personally I made my call, like I always do fully cognisant of the fact that both sides in politics lie and mislead to suit themselves.
To just obsess about one side and it’s politcking, gets us nowhere.

Enterprise_1701C

Deutsch Bank, the so called "canary" in the coal mine of Europe, had a share price high of 88.41 euros in 2006 and is currently at 6.89 euros.

Italy is in recession, Greece is about to blow up again, Turkey is a big debtor of eu banks and is about to default.

If you looked at the above when considering if to join a group, would you seriously consider joining? It is in a mess, they just don't like that information getting out, that is why we hear so little about it, especially with the funding the BBC don't want to lose.

Herzlos

Or you could look at the whole picture and what we get out of it. Are all of those problems down to the EU? Will they affect us in the EU? Will they affect us even from outside?

Anyone could point to plenty examples which taken in isolation would make the UK look like a disaster to join.

Tromking wrote: »

So, just to get this right.
Remain deal in facts that suddenly morph into mere inaccurate predictions if they’re wrong and Leave are just liars?
Look, this whole business is as it’s always been, an exercise in democracy that requires of its a participants a judgment call.
Speaking personally I made my call, like I always do fully cognisant of the fact that both sides in politics lie and mislead to suit themselves.
To just obsess about one side and it’s politcking, gets us nowhere.

What Remain campaigned on was believed to be true at the time based on the information available. Standard predictions. I'm not talking about any facts here as none of them have changed.

Leave on the other hand, made a catalog of claims that they knew we're false at the time. That's why I'm accusing them of lying. They made some predictions that weren't bad, but lotsof claims that are still regurgitated despite not standing up to any scrutiny. Turkey joining, 350m/week, EU army, unelected beaurocrats and so on.

mayonnaise

Enterprise_1701C wrote: »

Italy is in recession

FACT CHECK: Italy's economy grew 0.2 percent on quarter in the first three months of 2019
https://tradingeconomics.com/italy/gdp-growth

Enterprise_1701C wrote: »

Greece is about to blow up again

FACT CHECK: Greece has now entered a period of economic growth that puts it among the top performers in the eurozone.
https://www.imf.org/en/News/Articles/2019/03/11/na031119-greece-economy-improves-key-reforms-still-needed

Enterprise_1701C wrote: »

that is why we hear so little about it

You hear little about it because it didn't happen.

Tromking

Herzlos wrote: »

What Remain campaigned on was believed to be true at the time based on the information available. Standard predictions. I'm not talking about any facts here as none of them have changed.

Leave on the other hand, made a catalog of claims that they knew we're false at the time. That's why I'm accusing them of lying. They made some predictions that weren't bad, but lotsof claims that are still regurgitated despite not standing up to any scrutiny. Turkey joining, 350m/week, EU army, unelected beaurocrats and so on.

If you can't see the double standard in your answer, then there's little more to be said.