BW Legal Armtrac Sennen car park

Husqvarney

Well after spending most of the day on this forum reading up on what I need to do. I thought I'd better join up and make first post.
I received a PCN from Armtrac Security Services back on 26th August of 2017 for parking in Sennen Top car park in Cornwall. I had purchased a ticket and placed it on the dashboard. The PCN was for incorrectly displaying the ticket face down. The ticket was valid and has a serial number on the reverse that matches a number on the front. The parking charge was £100 or £60 if paid within 14 days. I had a look on this forum back then and the rough outline of what I read then was not to pay it. So I didn't.
I tried to log on to Armtrac's website but it initially would not let me in. I tried later and could see that they had taken various photos of the ticket and the car etc.
Role on to the 8th Nov 2017 and I get a Notice to Keeper. I still felt obliged to not pay it or even reply having purchased a valid ticket.
11th Dec 2017 I get a final letter before debt recovery or court action from Armtrac. Wasn't actually a Letter of Claim so I ignored it. I didn't bother appealing as this forum seem to be saying appeals seem just to get ignored.
19th April 2018 I get a Notice of intention to advise client to issue summons from TNC parking services for a creditor Armtrac and asking for £179. £100 notice payment and £79 administration charge.
29th Nov 2018 I simultaneously get get a letter from Armtrac saying the account has been passed to their legal team and a letter from BW Legal asking for £160, £100 PCN and £60 initial legal costs and various threats of seeking their clients instructions to to commence legal proceedings against me in the County Court. Ignored as still not a Letter of Claim.
Surprise surprise Dec 17th 2018 comes around and a Letter of Claim from BW Legal arrives saying KBT Cornwall trading as Armtrac Security Services have instructed them to commence legal proceedings requesting payment of £160 or reasons for non payment by 19th January 2019. Various forms are attached along with an estimated total if it goes to court of £245.43.

So having read the 'Newbies' posts I have just sent an SAR request to Armtrac DPO via email an copied myself and an email to BW Legal telling them I have and why I think the PCN is unreasonable having purchased and display a valid ticket albeit it upside down. Pointing out the serial numbering used on both sides of the ticket is a means they can see the ticket is valid. Further pointing out the ticket was not robust for a windy cliff top carpark. The ticket did have a sticky peel backing although I did not notice this at the time. I asked for further data processing to be put on hold and stated as payment to park was made, any alleged deviation from a contract is de minimis and too trivial to ask a court to adjudicate on. Pointing out their client has no reasonable prospect of success, and warned that I will apply for all costs as allowable under CPR27.14(2)(g)
This post is just to record the status as is.
I will probably send an e-mail to my local MP and the one covering the Sennen area about these parking claims sharks having read the post about doing same when the dust settles.
I read about the witness statement and putting a defence together for when/if it goes to court but haven't started this yet as waiting for their next move.

Any further advice most welcome.
Cheers in advance :beer:

Guys_Dad

So, after reading the NEWBIES section

You admitted you were driving.
You admitted placing the ticket upside down.
Their ticket had adhesive but you didn't notice.

You really have made it much more difficult for anyone here to help you.

KeithP

Post again when a Claim Form drops through your letter-box.

Husqvarney

Thanks for the fast replies.
No Guys Dad I did not say I was driving I said I purchased the ticket. I didn't say anything about who was driving. I didn't say I placed it upside or that the ticket had adhesive on it in my reply to BW Legal. That is just what I wrote in the post to help readers understand the situation.

Will do KeithP

Oh and I should thank those that have created the newbies threads and all those that have given their time to assist folk on this parking ticket sub forum. Cheers

Husqvarney

I've just received the below from BW Legal. From what I read on this forum I reply to the first 4 points only? They already have their ref in my original mail (I realise its an automated reply). I will not give my telephone number.

Thank you for contacting BW Legal.

Your email has been received and will be dealt with as soon as possible.

Before we are able to reply we need you to confirm a few Data Protection Questions which we have specified below.

If your email does not contain the below information, we kindly request you resend your email with the required information to enable us to deal with your query effectively.

BW Legal Reference:

Full Name:

First Line of Address:

Postcode:

Telephone Contact Number:

Authorised Email address:

Confirmation you wish for us to correspond with you via this address (Yes/No):

We make no commitment to response times on this general email account. Therefore, if you consider your matter is urgent, or should you wish to discuss your account with one of our helpful representatives today, you can call our offices on 0113 323 4479 and we will be happy to help.

BW Legal

Guys_Dad

Husqvarney wrote: »

Thanks for the fast replies.
No Guys Dad I did not say I was driving I said I purchased the ticket. I didn't say anything about who was driving. I didn't say I placed it upside or that the ticket had adhesive on it in my reply to BW Legal. That is just what I wrote in the post to help readers understand the situation.

Will do KeithP

Oh and I should thank those that have created the newbies threads and all those that have given their time to assist folk on this parking ticket sub forum. Cheers

Good you didn't admit would was driving but as BW Legal are irrelevant for now - see Newbies advice - then court is the only real next step the PPC can take. At that point, they can show that their tickets have adhesive backs, thereby differentiating your situation from the previous example on here where the case was thrown out for that reason.

The_Deep

It is the will of Parliament that these scammers, (very often former clampers), be put out of business.

Hopefully that will take place in the near future. The Bill has passed through the HOC without hitch, and goes to the Lords soon. In the meantime involve your MP, the poor dears are buckling under the weight of complaints about these scammers.

This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of alleged contracts for alleged parking offences, aided and abetted by a handful of low-rent solicitors. Is has been suggested by an MP that some of these companies may have connections to organised crime.

Parking Eye, CPM, Smart, (especially Smart}, and others have already been named and shamed in the House of Commons as have Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (these two law firms take hundreds of these cases to court each week), hospital car parks and residential complex tickets have been especially mentioned. They lose most of them, and have been reported to the regulatory authority by an M.P. for unprofessional conduct

The problem has become so widespread that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers.

Sir Greg Knight's Private Members Bill to curb the excesses, and perhaps close down, some of these companies passed its Third Reading in late November, and, with a fair wind, will become Law next year.

All three readings are available to watch on the internet, (some 6-7 hours), and published in Hansard. MPs have an extremely low opinion of the industry. Many are complaining that they are becoming overwhelmed by complaints from members of the public. Add to their burden, complain in the most robust terms about the scammers.

Husqvarney

Just been reading the Newbies thread again and post 2 and I'm confused. Should I being doing an Acknowledgement of Service now or waiting for the 'claim form' or a summons? The MCOL guide seems to be talking about a summons and the last communication I've had is Letter of Claim from BW Legal. Hope I haven't left it too late!

Le_Kirk

You won't be getting a summons, this is civil not criminal (although the regulars on here say it is but with a different definition of criminal!)

On the Letter of Claim (LOC), did it give you 30 days to respond, provide proof of the claim with evidence and include financial forms? If not, it is not a proper LOC. If it did, wait for the forms from Northampton CCBC and then you can do the AOS. It's difficult to see how you can do AOS without logging in details for MCOL.

Coupon-mad

You are fine, you haven't got a claim yet. You WILL get a claim but that's when the scam will soon be over, and you are likely to win (not guaranteed but your case is like all the other 'fluttering ticket' ones at that location and Armtrac know all about it. It's what they do, the tickets are flimsy.

Try searching the forum for Armtrac flimsy fluttering ticket as research.

You can answer these Qs to BW Legal but this stage is all a game to them:

Before we are able to reply we need you to confirm a few Data Protection Questions which we have specified below.

If your email does not contain the below information, we kindly request you resend your email with the required information to enable us to deal with your query effectively.

BW Legal Reference:

Full Name:

First Line of Address:

Postcode:

Telephone Contact Number:

Authorised Email address:

Confirmation you wish for us to correspond with you via this address (Yes/No):

Husqvarney

Thanks guys. Yes the LOC does give me 30 days to reply which I have via e-mail and asked them to put the claim on hold while Amtrac give me all the data they have. The LOC has various reply forms and income and expenditure forms (Cheeky beggers!) which I've ignored.
I've replied to BW legal's auto e-mail reply with the additional info they have requested which they already had. Not given my phone number.
I've registered on the MCOL site so now just waiting for the SAR info and the claim to follow up with the AOS.