Mis-sold car hire upgrade

WiltshireMum

Thanks photome. I fear we may have learnt a very expensive life lesson about checking paperwork. I'll have to hope they take pity on me

TadleyBaggie

If you couldn't even remember how you paid for the car hire, isn't it possible you also don't remember exactly what was said?

When I've ever been offered an upgrade it has always been clear on the paperwork it is a per day charge.

WiltshireMum

Hi Tadley,

My husband was fairly certain he hadn't paid cash but when there was no charge on the credit card he thought maybe he had. I was not present when he paid. My memory is 100% clear that he told me in the office it was £10 for the whole duration. I remember him saying we were having an upgrade because I said no, we can't afford it and he said it's okay it's only £10. I honestly think the sales person must have heard him say that as we were on opposite sides of the office as I was chasing after a toddler. My husband may not 100% trust husband own memory on how he paid but I am absolutely certain he said £10 for the whole duration. All I can think is maybe the sales guy thought he meant £10 per day for every day of the hire period, not £10 for the whole duration.

TadleyBaggie

It would be a case of one word against another, suspect the agent will claim they said it was £10 per day. Do you still have the paperwork you were given at the time?

WiltshireMum

Hi no we don't have the paperwork. But I'm not disputing the £228 charge was on there. I have an invoice they sent through after the rental finished and it's on there. My husband said he saw £228 and asked if that was the deposit and he was told yes. What he very stupidly didn't do was look to the left of that amount and see the bit that said customer choice £10 x 19 days plus vat. I'm not saying we aren't at fault here, it's totally ridiculous that he didn't spot that but we were in a rush, my son was playing up and he did question the £228 and wasn't told it was the upgrade charge. Yes it will come down to our word against theirs which is why I'm asking if anyone has any experience of this as I have no way of proving what happened. I can't believe the sales guy didn't overhear him tell me it was £10 for the whole duration but i can't prove anything

peterbaker

I must admit, as a regular hirer from a top five car rental company I was first in two minds about the propriety of the car hire company's side of the deal the OP describes.

True - each of us very much needs our wits about us when hiring a car as can be shown by all manner of hire car rip off stories both in these forums and elsewhere on the internet.

Car rental contracts are actually very complex contracts - I would go as far as to say that due to their complexity, the manner of the selling should be as tightly regulated as insurance contracts, or the selling of loans - arguably car rental includes elements of both.

As a regular car hire customer who generally sticks to one major rental company, I can arrive at the desk and be away again with the key and rental agreement in literally less than a minute and with a free upgrade every time, but most people shouldn't be in such a hurry to sign and leave the desk as fast as I usually do

I too will often get offered a further upgrade for an extra daily charge but in most cases I negotiate it way down or decline.

I can do any revised deal in their shorthand style because I know that the moment they mention a figure the discussion will be a daily figure not (and never in my experience), a total figure. I always find myself then saying "So that means an extra on the total already paid of £XX?"

Most hirers aren't so familiar with the territory. There is an argument to suggest that sellers should be statutorily forced to point out the total revised expected total price. If an increased loan cost another £10 a day in interest, then the loan would be missold if that extra cost was described as "just for £10 extra" or even if it was described as "just for £10 extra per day" and no revised total price was given in signed paperwork handed over there and then.

There are in fact many potential pitfalls in hiring a car which most customers may not ever consider until a driving mistake is made. Yet you are always asked to sign to accept liability for them if they come up, whether you understand or not. How many hirers are aware of them all or how much they might cost? The normal level of insurance is in many case the first big problem. It's not full insurance and you will inevitably find yourself paying for a surprising first part of any damage you have signed as responsible for. I.e. there's almost inevitably going to be an insurance "excess". Excesses can typically start at several hundred pounds often busting £1,000 with some care hire companies especially on more expensive vehicles, but their full price including full insurance is never quoted on comparison sites. Is that fair? I don't think so.

The biggest and most common extra charges in my experience are associated with

• buying full insurance at the counter (i.e. no excess)
• not adhering to a full-full fuel deal
• not checking very carefully for existing damage before you leave the car park and then getting held liable for it when you return
• incurring car rental admin charges if you are caught on traffic or parking cameras where of course the initial ticket goes to the rental company.

Of course, to someone who regular hires expensive cars, perhaps none of the above are particularly troublesome, but if you are a moneysaver like me, you begin to wince when the quoted daily hire charge for a Group C e.g. Vauxhall Astra or Ford Focus exceeds £25 before full insurance and other extras. That often happens at Christmas time and at one or two other times of the year.

So if you get invoiced after you've dropped the car off for things like:

• ten litres of fuel at a rental agreement price of £3.80 per litre to top up the almost but not quite full tank you left them when the deal says you should bring it back full
• £100 for scratching an alloy wheel that you don't think you scratched
• £80 for repairing a slow puncture that you discovered but no-previous renter had owned up to, so it is assumed it happened while you were driving it
• £50 admin fee for passing your driver details to a private land parking enforcement company who nabbed you on their ANPR machine
• £80 for cleaning the car because someone smoked in it

then these can very quickly spoil your original canny moneysaving efforts

We regular hirers are alive to all these and that's one reason I tend to hire from the same place each time - it's a large company who do value their reputation (like Europcar perhaps, but unlike many of those companies quoting the cheapest upfront prices) - I deal with a team at the hire office who all know me and whom I trust, and they treat me with friendliness and a level of respect that indicates they value loyalty right down the line. However, the "sellers" at the desk are all tasked to "sell" upgrades and each will use their own spiel to start the sales conversation e.g "special deal brcause we've run short of Group C today", so you have to expect a bit of kiddology about what comes out of their mouths in a largely unregulated sales environment.

That said, we are taling Europcar, so we would hope they value their reputation enough not to let maverick sellers routinely mislead the punters with the inevitable inertia to complete a deal and get away that a busy car hire desk and queue usually creates.

There are many other companies that come up cheapest on, for example, Ryanair's comparison website with their so-called cheapest price promise but personally I wouldn't touch those with a bargepole. I have a personal theory that the cheapest in their lists probably make most of their profit out of over-invoicing post rental for damage you probably didn't do, and which they have no intention of repairing until the car has collected lots more damage!

Might be interesting if the OP told us what car they had hired originally and what car they were upgraded to, and whether it was a Christmas holiday period hire. I recently paid £150 over Christmas for a Group C for 4½ days (5 days charged) and felt that I'd done well. As a regular I got given a free upgrade to a fun steering wheel flippy paddle 7 gear auto Group E car.

Then contrast that with my hire over New Year - I had booked a two day hire for £75 (also ok I thought) but then found at short notice that I needed to extend it by two days. Knock me down with a feather if instead of paying extra for that, I didn't get given a £15 credit! Again I'd booked Group C, but as the free upgrade this time I got given an A3 S.line Hatchback which was quite good fun.

With my regular car rental company I know pretty much what to expect in each situation, but those who advise occasional hirers to read the Ts and Cs before signing and establish exactly what's what or "be more alert" are not exactly being realistic with such complex contracts being fiddled with on the spot.

That's why my general view is that car rental selling should ideally be made tightly regulated under the auspices of a regulator such as FCA. At the sharp end of the business, a clearly presented (A4 size normal 12pt font) total price already paid and total expected to pay should not only be printed off, but the key information properly explained by the seller before asking for a signature.

I also strongly believe that the level of excess for normal insurance should be as clearly shown at quote comparison stage as the total price quoted, and alongside it should always be the total price to include full insurance i.e. with nil excess) - shown in the same size print. In my book, these things should not be tolerated when buried in the small print.

So based mostly on the general poorly regulated situation as I see it, I am generally with the OP in considering making a complaint, but is she confident that her other half didn't just get carried away with "treating himself and the family" and was simply too keen to sign at the desk, wanting to get the car keys and away?

As an aside, did the OP's other half choose to buy or to dismiss full insurance, or was the potential loss of several hundred pounds as an insurance excess just something else not fully understood, signed for too quickly, and a fortuitous narrow escape?

Car hire customers too often learn the hard way about the sharp practice that can unfortunately exist in the industry due to poor or even zero regulation.

WiltshireMum

Hi Peter,

Thanks for your reply.

The hire period was over Christmas but I booked well in advance to secure a good rate. The original booking was for a Vauxhall Astra which was upgraded to a Vauxhall Mokka. Not a significant upgrade and certainly not worth £10 a day. It never even crossed my mind that £10 would be a per day charge because who would spend £190 (plus vat which was never mentioned) just to have a car that is ever so slightly bigger but less economical. We thought they just wanted to get a minimal amount for something they would have given for free as it was the busy Christmas period and they were short on compact cars.

My husband certainly was in a rush to get done with the paperwork, our son had a cold and hadn't napped all day during our travels so we were all a bit frazzled and in a rush. But no, he wouldn't have got carried away trying to do something nice for his family. For context we live on just one income as my son is only just 2 and I've not returned to work yet. To fund Christmas as well as his recent 2nd birthday we have had to massively cut back on our spending, we have no social life and I don't even buy certain groceries which I like but consider too expensive. We've been so cautious with our spending he would never have agreed to the upgrade if he had known the true cost, not to a Mokka and not even to a top of the range, luxury sports car which you've been upgraded to. He is very silly to have not read carefully every line of the paperwork but he is not so daft as to waste £228 on something totally unnecessary. That's quite a few nights out and trips to the soft play for our son and I know what he would rather spend the money on!

I will await customer service's response and hope they take pity. We've been silly but also we've been totally taken advantage of and misled which is very disappointing. We don't often hire cars so I fear we've been a bit naive and assumed the sales guy was doing something nice for a family at Christmas time.
Lesson learned!

loskie

I am very surprised a Mokka is an upgrade from an Astra. Size wise they are the same! This would be my line of challenge it is NOT an upgrade.

OP I don't mean to be critical but reading your various posts you say you both are tired, rushed, chasing around after toddler so obviously your mind isn't on the rental transaction. Yet you have very specific memory of the bits you want, it doesn't add up.
I think in the past when I have hired cars and been offered an upgrade in various countries the charge is quite clearly a daily one and a fair percentage of the original pre booked deal.
I have not paid for an upgrade, if the hire co does not have the car you booked that is their problem not yours.

You have not been misled other than being told a Mokka is an upgrade.

WiltshireMum

Hello Ioskie,

Thanks for your comment. I wasn't not present at the desk with my husband so my memory of what he told me happened is fresh because we just had the conversation this last week when I saw the charge on the invoice.

I can assure you he 100% told me on the day inside the office that it was £10 for the duration. Yes we were frazzled and rushing but we've had to be so careful with money when he shouted over that we were having an upgrade I told him we cant afford it, I clearly remember that. I can also describe to you the other staff members present, conversations that were had with them and also other car hire agents while my son was toddling around the office. We were stressed but my memory is very good and I'm not sure what would make you believe it isn't.

The only confusion was my husband thought he might have paid cash but that was an assumption we came to when there was no £10 charge on my card. I said he must have paid cash (I wasn't present a time the desk) and he said he really didn't think so but if there was no credit card charge then he must have done.

I know we're stupid for not checking the paperwork but we aren't so stupid as to make up details of what happened. My husband has a very good memory and he's not daft, he also wouldn't lie to me telling me he queried the £228 if he didn't. Implying that he's making up details is actually quite offensive. We're an honest (if naïve and silly) couple who have been ripped off and now I'm looking for advice on how to handle the situation, I'm not looking for criticism and accusations. I'm also not saying this was a deliberate rip off, the sales guy seemed really nice and I hope he just assumed we would know he meant £10 a day and he didn't see what my husband pointed at on the invoice or didn't hear properly when he queried the £228. I don't like to think of anyone deliberately ripping us off, that makes the whole situation even worse so I can't think like that. So thank you for your comments but please refrain from accusing and insulting, it doesn't help me.

WiltshireMum

Before anyone else comments can I please just say this has really stressed me out, we can't afford to waste £228. I came on this forum for advice and I'm already aware that we've been very silly but we are not dishonest and I don't need any comments implying we are or telling me again how stupid we've been. My poor husband is very much in the dog house and I'm trying very hard not to beat him up over his mistake and being taken advantage of. Please can you all just be kind! Thanks in advance for any further constructive comments ��