Outfox The Market Direct Debit changes

jaybeetoo

I think the problem is that OTM doesn’t have a big company behind them. There have been some big increases in wholesales prices over a very short period (as witnessed by the recent price rises from OTM). I wouldn’t be surprised if OTM looked at their cash flow projections over the next few months and panicked. They’ve introduced this changed too quickly to properly think it through.

I don’t have a problem with what they are doing - it’s the way they have gone about it which makes me concerned and why I am leaving.

[Deleted User]

Copy of email sent to: [EMAIL="response@outfoxthemarket.co.uk"]response@outfoxthemarket.co.uk[/EMAIL]
sent in reply to their latest email. Notice that they don't use a customer name, or give a customer account number. Neither do they give the name of the sender apart from OFTM.



Notice too, how they say at the end that I can submit an up to date meter reading!!! No contractual obligation here, no photos. And you will notice that I have sent any kind of meter reading. Why? Well, I am awaiting their instructions...after all, if they don't tell me what to do, I might get it wrong, and then, where will we be...I might have to pay them money or become liable, whereas if they tell me what to do, as is their want...then they become liable. A clever lawyer will notice such things...:-).
ATB
Dougie.



Dear Company,
I am very pleased to hear that. It sounds absolutely wonderful the way you have dressed up the enormous increase in my direct debit. So much so that I have decided to leave your company after only 6 weeks membership. I am 73 years old and on a fixed income. I like regular bills spread out evenly over the year without surprises so that I can budget properly. I have learned how to use the internet and how to read my meters and how to send them to the likes of your company safely, at the appointed time, so that you don't have to estimate my usage. However, I cannot take photos of my electricity meter, because it is too high up and in an awkward place and I have to use stepladders and would have to use both hands to take photos. I can however provide a photo of my gas reading and a hand typed reading of my electricity meter? Is a meter reading by me no longer good enough? Do you not have a facility that if you do not trust my reading, you can send in a meter reading company...at your expense?
Do you carry public and third party indemnity insurance by the way, so that if I fall and injure myself whilst taking the photos, I can claim from your insurance company? as I would be acting according to your express company contractual instructions, you would be liable? You have left me in a state of shock, amazement, and dare I say, made me very upset. Not that you appear to care. You just want money, after conning me into joining your company.

I am a pensioner. I am unsteady on my feet. I made a contractual agreement with you because I recognised and accepted that you were the cheapest in the market place and because you were giving me green energy and were outfoxing the market on price and customer care.
However, I am not a rabbit, or a sacrificial lamb, and whilst I am really pleased that you are outfoxing the market, I am not pleased or impressed about your pathetic attempt to outfox me and tell me that you are in fact, doing me a favour.

So, now I have another problem, which I wish to share with you and your OFTM team, and from whom I require advice.
As I am switching to another company on December 13th. approx. I would like to leave your company not owing you any money, and not leaving you owing me money. At the moment, so far as I know I am in credit. Although I can see how much I am in credit on my account on your website, you have as yet not supplied me with a bill or breakdown of my account including usage and membership fees. My contractual reading date is on the 9th of the Month.

Can you suggest to me a way this can be done...
Yours sincerely,
********** ******
Dear Customer,
Following the recent changes to our direct debit policy we have helped thousands of customers manage their accounts with payments that accurately match their energy use.
We are keen to assist everyone who wishes to discuss their payments and you can contact us via the methods listed below. As you might appreciate, demand is higher than usual, but we will respond to everyone individually and we thank you for your continued patience.
IMPORTANT We have had some feedback from customers concerned that the new winter uplift will be their new payment for the next 12 months. THIS IS NOT CORRECT. To be abundantly clear, these payments will be limited to December, January, February and March. Your payments will then be reduced to the much lower summer schedule for April, May, June, July, August and September. The winter uplift will then begin again in October 2019.
REFUNDS If your account is in credit and sufficient to cover a minimum of two months consumption, we will happily process any refunds.
THE COST TO SUPPLY ENERGY Unfortunately, there is no credit card for energy and we purchase it in advance. This allows us to provide the cheap rates we do. In return, we ask our customers to pay for the energy they consume which results in cheaper energy for everyone.
Companies who offer a fixed monthly direct debit will charge you higher rates and once the winter is over, are likely to increase your direct debit payments and/or ask you to pay a lump sum. What really matters is the price you pay per unit.
WHOLESALE We pass on a true reflection of the cost of energy to our customers and the price you pay remains one of the cheapest in your region and the UK.
This company was set up to do things differently and over the last 18 months we have helped thousands of customers significantly reduce their energy costs. We can continue to keep our prices low if our customers simply pay for the energy they use. You can help us with this by reading your meter every month.
We are working hard to reply to every email and once again, we thank you for your patience. Yours sincerely
OTM Team

Chat live at outfoxthemarket.co.uk
Email: [EMAIL="response@outfoxthemarket.co.uk"]response@outfoxthemarket.co.uk[/EMAIL]
For meter readings Email: [EMAIL="response@outfoxthemarket.co.uk"]MR@outfoxthemarket.co.uk[/EMAIL]
For refund requests Email:[EMAIL="response@outfoxthemarket.co.uk"]Refunds@outfoxthemarket.co.uk[/EMAIL]

Please include an up-to-date meter reading.

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08.30am – 17.00pm Friday
09.00am – 2.00pm Saturday
Closed – Sunday



Outfox the Market
North Mills, Frog Island Leicester, LE3 5DL
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shaftthemarket

PS it appears there are certain four letter words Mr Lewis does not approve of - you will have to imagine what !!!! stands for!

orangesnaps

Hengus wrote: »

I can understand the frustration and annoyance that OFTM's change of policy has generated. I have ditched and switched because I was annoyed at a supplier, and it ended up costing me more than if I had stayed. A few facts to ponder on:

1. OFTM is not asking you to pay anymore for the energy that you use based on your agreed tariff.

2. It is rescheduling your payments: more in Winter and less in Summer.

3. Switching today will take at least 17 days and possibly 35 days.

4. OFTM has 6 weeks after the date of actual transfer to raise a Final Bill. Credit repayments will then follow.

5. Switching late in the season will inevitably lead to a higher monthly DD as most smaller suppliers have ts and cs which state that there must be enough credit to cover the following month's charges. 1/12 of the annual cost will not be enough for most homes and a lot of the smaller suppliers now charge more per month for late in year switches.

6. If OFTM goes under, then the bailout cost will be reflected in all our future bills.

7. In the event of a supplier failure, all credit balances are now 100% protected under Ofgem's SoLR regulations.

In sum, OFTM customers switching today could be in for some short term financial pain. And, finally, before anyone asks, I do not work for or represent any entity in the energy sector

They have increased my membership fee without informing me & have tried to make it seem like it was the original agreed upon amount when I switched to them by changing the amounts from the previous bills down to the welcome pack. That is fraud!

Fair enough that they are just going to charge me what we are using as I always submit meter readings on time and on the day that my billing cycle ends to avoid estimated bills.
But increasing the membership fee when my estimated annual usage for electricity has gone down compared to last year's is not on! And to do it in such an underhanded manner just beggars belief as it is fraud plain and simple!

Unfortunately for them, I took screenshots of my bills so even if they managed to update the welcome pack and June & July bill to reflect the higher membership fee, my bills from Aug-Oct shows the original membership fee of £13.99.

We are definitely going to switch even if it will cost as more, why? Because of peace of mind. Worse comes to worse, we will go with Bulb as they pay customers exit fee & we get a £50 credit to the account and then we'll switch to one of the big 6 after a few months, we may pay more but at least they don't act like outfox the customer does. They are 'cheap' for a reason but I suspect, won't be for long.

allison445

Email received on the 13th November about the price increase had my
Projected Annual cost with increase at £592.87
Email on the 15th November about new winter direct debit payments and my new
Projected Annual cost is now £677.55
I am In credit and use the same amount of electricity monthly all year round I have a very tight budget and am very thrifty for me even a £5 a month increase would have hit hard.
I moved quickly from Octopus who toke over from Iresa and at that point outfox were the cheapest.
My time is precious I won't argue with a company that treats its customers like s@@t I just switched to a different supplier saving myself £2 a year may not be a massive saving but its a saving.

BedrockFred

Hengus wrote: »

I can understand the frustration and annoyance that OFTM's change of policy has generated. I have ditched and switched because I was annoyed at a supplier, and it ended up costing me more than if I had stayed. A few facts to ponder on:

1. OFTM is not asking you to pay anymore for the energy that you use based on your agreed tariff.

2. It is rescheduling your payments: more in Winter and less in Summer.

3. Switching today will take at least 17 days and possibly 35 days.

4. OFTM has 6 weeks after the date of actual transfer to raise a Final Bill. Credit repayments will then follow.

5. Switching late in the season will inevitably lead to a higher monthly DD as most smaller suppliers have ts and cs which state that there must be enough credit to cover the following month's charges. 1/12 of the annual cost will not be enough for most homes and a lot of the smaller suppliers now charge more per month for late in year switches.

6. If OFTM goes under, then the bailout cost will be reflected in all our future bills.

7. In the event of a supplier failure, all credit balances are now 100% protected under Ofgem's SoLR regulations.

In sum, OFTM customers switching today could be in for some short term financial pain. And, finally, before anyone asks, I do not work for or represent any entity in the energy sector

Ermmm OK why do you feel the need to put that?

cyka

Hengus wrote: »

1. OFTM is not asking you to pay anymore for the energy that you use based on your agreed tariff.

Actually, customers are, for the winter, at least. What OFTM did was incorporated the new 3 recent price rises into the customers Estimated Annual Cost and then added 10-20% on-top to compensate what I assume is for further price increases early next year.
From this new EAC figure they worked out the average DD per month added a further 40-50% increase to monthly DD winter payments.

ben501

Hengus wrote: »

1. OFTM is not asking you to pay anymore for the energy that you use based on your agreed tariff.



, I have not worked for or represented any entity in the energy sector

I am only guessing here, but could it be that those who are having their overall direct debit charge increased have been on a variable rate tariff for a few months, and following (at least 2?) price rises their monthly payment needs increasing to reflect the increased rates?




As you mention it, you have piqued my curiosity. Do you have 'insider knowledge' or just an informed opinion? You do spend a lot of time here advising & trying to help people. Is the amended comment as true as your original?

ben501

orangesnaps wrote: »

They have increased my membership fee without informing me

Yeah, they do that

Our Tariffs

The monthly membership fee is based on your estimated annual consumption (EAC) which will be totalled if you have more than one MPAN.
You will be required to provide your EAC initially upon sign up and this will be verified once we receive the relevant data flow from your previous supplier. If required it will be adjusted accordingly as well as being amended according to any meter readings you provide which indicate your more accurate actual consumption. Please note that your EAC is a changing figure dependant on your usage and this will result in your membership band being amended at any point based on the most up to date consumption information available.

ivorfiner

02/11/2018 Direct debit £87.84 CR
01/11/2018 Invoice £1.93 DR
02/10/2018 Direct debit £89.77 CR



I switched to gain lower payments than my previous supplier. I had agreed a DD of £89---- and, as a senior citizen on benefits, I am certainly not prepared to suddenly pay approx double. All seems very fishy to me. I'm switching and in touch with ofgem.

Email sent on: 15 November 2018
Account Number:
Dear Mr
As part of our obligations as an energy supplier and in accordance with Ofgem’s guidance, we are required to do all we can to limit the risk of customers accruing a debt on their account.
With the winter fast approaching and following a review of your Direct Debit, we have found that your current payment is not sufficient to cover your expected energy consumption.
In light of this, we are providing 10 working days notice of our intention to introduce a new variable Direct Debit scheme that will change your payments to £157.10. This revised figure will continue throughout the winter.
From April 2019 until September 2019, your consumption will reduce, and this will be reflected in your Direct Debit payments being lowered to suit. Your monthly Direct Debit for this period will be £67.33. Your winter payments will then begin again from October 2019.
Estimated
Annual
Cost Current

Direct Debit October to
March

Monthly Direct Debit April to
September

Monthly Direct Debit
£1346.55 £89.77 £157.10 £67.33
These revised figures should provide additional peace-of-mind with the understanding that your new payments match your actual energy consumption. This will minimise the possibility of 'bill shock’ at the end of the winter, help spread your extra energy consumption into a manageable amount and ensure you only pay for the energy you use in the warmer months.
If you have any queries regarding this email, please get in touch and one of our team will be able to help.
Yours sincerely