Engine Refurbished...or not?

leedom

Hi


My car engine seized and to cut a long story short, it went to an 'engine specialist' to be refurbished. 1.7k quickly became 3.1k...


Lots of work done (or supposed to be done) and i got the car back. Then starts overheating (probably the issue in the first place). Anyway, i took it to Vauxhall and issue still not fixed (new radiator and expansion tank). Vauxhall have advised there must be an issue with the engine block.


This is exactly what the 'specialist' told me had been done and more interesting is that Vauxhall have said that the work they said was done (eg chemical clean etc) has not been done on the parts that they can easily see....another example is the oil pump that the specialist has said was refurbished - Vauxhall tell me it is filthy and no way has it been touched. I have had the car for only 400 miles since being 'fixed'.


Vauxhall have suggested an independent report from AA/similar.


Anyone with any advise as the best way forward? I am not sure I want to send the car back to them.


I am thinking writing to them to put the issues to them and see what they say in the first instance. Then, depending on their response, reporting them to trading standards and possibly attempt to get my money back through small claims court if they do not play ball. At this stage it looks like i have been done up like a kipped and they as they have misled me (seemingly) and this has got be to some sort of criminal act?


I would be grateful for any advice please. Also, can anyone undertake the independent engine inspection - i would need to show them what should have been done and would like photos..


Many thanks

Arklight

Just to clarify, your car went wrong, you took it to one place to be fixed, it broke again so you took it to a second place who had a poor opinion of the first place's work.

Have you given the first garage a chance to rectify or comment on the second failure? This is starting to sound like good money being thrown after bad. What is the car age and mileage?

System

Seized engine = scrap engine which cannot be repaired or reconditioned. So you're looking at least at an entirely different engine with different engine number, I wouldn't even consider entertaining reconditioning a seized engine. Given the oil pump is hidden inside the engine and reconditioning an oil pump merely involved replacing the two gears inside it, ensuring the cover plate is smooth and replacing the oil pressure spring then unless the Vauxhall garage have had the sump off, taken the oil pump off and stripped it they cannot tell from an external examination if it has been done or not.

To be honest it sounds like the Vauxhall garage is stitching you up as much as anything as well. Sadly mechanics nowadays tend to be incapable of fault finding if a computer doesn't tell them what is wrong so they change the obvious big stuff which may not even be the problem and are blaming their inability to fix it on the recon. If it was a fault of the reconditioned engine then you'd either be noticing the coolant level going down and have emulsified oil or notice white smoke coming out the exhaust or a simple "sniff test" of the coolant would reveal exhaust gases in the coolant. Given that you've not said any of those things have happened then the fault doesn't likely lie with the reconditioned engine.

An independent diagnosis of the fault from a third party may be the best way forward and I think you may find that the Vauxhall garage isn't exactly going to come out of it looking good.

Jackmydad

I'd have gone back to the original place myself.
Did the Vauxhall place do a compression test, or an oil pressure test? (assuming the engine is running) is that within spec?

leedom

Thanks for the replies.


I am speaking face to face with Vauxhall tomorrow. The service manager said that air is being drawn into the system and he suspects that if the crack is low down in the block and that combustion gasses could be being forced in when the piston is near the bottom of its stroke and so a compression test would read OK.


Good money after bad, yes absolutely. I sent to an engine specialist and they have 'done' a big list of things but Vauxhall are now querying whether they have done some of the work they told me they had, telling me mating surfaces would be shiny and they are not. However, the changed the timing belt but not the water pump - i would have thought they would have at least given the option...and this might actually be the issue i suppose? Even the oil sump plug was not changed and it was chewed up (since replaced). The trouble is you get a quote then it becomes more and more. I wish I had not bothered to be honest and I perhaps should just get rid of it now - god knows who would want it though!



Also told me that it I clear the gearbox has been removed recently but yet a bolt is missing that secures it!

I wonder whether it is my engine that has been refurbished or another that has been dropped in....am I able to check engine numbers?


I think it best to get another opinion from another garage or as I say sell it on , disclosing the issue of course.

Ectophile

The engine number should be on the V5. Someone who is familiar with that engine should be able to find the engine number stamped on it somewhere.


There are refurbished engines and "refurbished" ones. Properly refurbishing means stripping the engine down to a pile of bits, throwing away and replacing anything that looks even a little bit damaged or worn, then building it back up again. Whereas "refurbishing" means buying an engine from a scrap yard and hosing it down with a jet wash.

Muscle750

Sounds to me as if theyve lobbed in another engine out of a scrap car or a stolen one which is duff anyway, Easily checked by checking the engine numbers. A while ago we had a Audi which had hit a post and had damaged the engine basically it snapped the bracket on the block for the alternator mount, Anyway insurance said it had to go to main dealer for new engine to be fitted as it was only a few months old. Anyway car come back and was been driven when it stopped , transpired the cambelt had snapped. Anyway transpired that even thou Audi had been told to put a brand new engine in it they hadnt and had cobbled the original unit, and were paid in excess of £6k for doing what they hadnt been told to do. The insurance became involved and they basically said it was a "admin error" their end . You can read what you want into that.

leedom

thanks all, time will tell...hopefully get some more info tomorrow - incl engine number


they have supposedly taken to bits n done all the chemical cleaning etc...

esmerobbo

Tarambor wrote: »

Given the oil pump is hidden inside the engine

Is it? Lots of Vauxhall oil pumps are in the front timing cover, and can be seen maybe this is one engine that has.

leedom

So I went to Vauxhall this morning and to re-cap:


Following substantial work that was undertaken on my car, I am still having issues with my car overheating (when given some welly as they say - it is fine when doing short journeys) and it has been to Vauxhall who have changed the expansion tank and radiator and told me the water pump is working fine. They have told me that they suspect there is excessive pressure coming from engine combustion gasses/internal engine fault.

I gave them the list of things the engine people said has been done and worryingly they have highlighted some concerns with regard to the reconditioning of the engine:

[*]Signs of old engine oil
[*]The cam head has white writing ‘Insignia’ that has been attempted to be scratched off – perhaps indicating it is from another car/breakers yard.
[*]Timing belt shows signs of wear (car has only done 500 miles since it left the garage – they also query why the water pump was not been changed considering the cost of the fix
[*]Surfaces are not clean as would be expected
[*]The cam head appears not to have been taken off (bolts are rusty and old and have not been touched for a long time)
[*]The gearbox has been taken off but a bolt is missing that secures it!
[*]The oil sump plug that was replaced at the oil change should have been replaced especially considering this is such an expensive job

Vauxhall said this could well have been another engine dropped in rather than all the jobs done as they say although it is impossible to say without stripping it down.


I am writing to the original garage to put these things to them and see what they say.


Anyone with any further advice...?


Many thanks as always

leedom

Muscle750 wrote: »

Sounds to me as if theyve lobbed in another engine out of a scrap car or a stolen one which is duff anyway, Easily checked by checking the engine numbers. A while ago we had a Audi which had hit a post and had damaged the engine basically it snapped the bracket on the block for the alternator mount, Anyway insurance said it had to go to main dealer for new engine to be fitted as it was only a few months old. Anyway car come back and was been driven when it stopped , transpired the cambelt had snapped. Anyway transpired that even thou Audi had been told to put a brand new engine in it they hadnt and had cobbled the original unit, and were paid in excess of £6k for doing what they hadnt been told to do. The insurance became involved and they basically said it was a "admin error" their end . You can read what you want into that.

As this is a second hand car they could easily say that the engine must have been changed before.....that sort of thing, I suppose