Why wills are rubbish

SevenOfNine

PasturesNew wrote: »

But it's not compulsory/well known ... so you'd need to know about it to put it there - and, most people would think "why put it there when I can have it right here", so it doesn't make sense for most.

Then any relative would need to know about that system and look. Unlikely if very few people have ever heard of it.


Yes, from a generation where they "trusted professionals". Trouble is, if somebody doesn't read it, or read it properly (and with mirror wills that's quite easily done when you're getting on quite a bit too ... and have gone to a proper solicitor... but the thing is nobody finds out there's a problem until after the Will maker's died.

The system ... is quite flawed in a lot of ways.

For "the little people" ... even if you pay and trust it's right ... and are confused and just trust the solicitor (who does this every day) .... mistakes are made far too often.

In our case, I COULD ... have fought off one claimant with an intestate will.... I could have just gone "HA! HA!" ... but we're normal/reasonable people in our family who knew what the Will meant and what was intended and had no wish to change any of that when it was declared as part intestate.

Thanks PasturesNew - but I'd appreciate it if you didn't cut & paste out of context snippets. :beer:

Keep_pedalling

unholyangel wrote: »

Yes fine and dandy, providing you never get involved with another person and don't make any changes. As we've seen time & time again on here, people go back on those promises despite obviously being trusted by their partners to do the right thing.

Mutual wills offer more assurances but again comes with a massive drawback.

Which is why if your situation changes you make new wills. If either of us gets remarried after the first dies, neither of us is going to disinherit our own children because of it. Nearly all of the problems you speak off occur with more complex situations where no will or an inappropriate will has been made

Dox

WELLSIANA1962 wrote: »

It is normally time for Martin to promote "WILL WEEK" so although i have many instances here is two for you to ponder why wills are a waste of time and money which are actually connected to me .
1 . My mum did a Mirror Will with her Husband and my stepfather of 25 years , she did a silly thing and died first , big no no if you have a will of this type , He took 1 year 4 months , to revoke her will , revoke Her children from the will and leave everything to his sole Daughter , because he revoked her i do not even own my Mums grave , which he is now cosy laid in beside the woman he shafted , Nothing can be done , so that will was a waste to her .Only because it was badly drawn up. And it certainly wasn't a waste to your stepfather!
2 . My wifes Dad left a will when he died almost 3 years ago , naming all 4 of his children as executors and basically to sell up and divide equal , going well so far , until the two oldest decided to lock the will inside the cabinet in the house , change the locks and keys , put his daughter into the house to pay rent to cover another siblings costs and scrub the will or probate , 3 years in an unmarked grave for that will dear boy , and one daughter does not even have a key to the house she basically quarter owns .If all 4 were named as executors, why did 2 of them let the other walk all over them? That's nothing to do with having a will - it is everything to do with not ensuring the correct processes are followed
So wills are a pathetic excuse for peace of mind in life , but in death where there is a will there will be a war , and no law will bother with the dead , so spend your money as someone else will.

Sorry, but you are spouting rubbish, particularly in respect of your father in law's estate.

unholyangel

Keep_pedalling wrote: »

Which is why if your situation changes you make new wills. If either of us gets remarried after the first dies, neither of us is going to disinherit our own children because of it. Nearly all of the problems you speak off occur with more complex situations where no will or an inappropriate will has been made

I agree they should be reviewed periodically and updated, its just good practice. We know that sometimes people don't though - sometimes for circumstances out of their control.

Neither of you would disinherit your own children, but can you say the same for any potential unknown partner? There could be a mental deterioration of the surviving spouse - either so they lose capacity or they become forgetful and forget to do important things like update their will. Or they could get remarried and then divorced with a settlement to pay their ex. However I do appreciate the difference between possibility and probability, I was just pointing out that there are various risks involved with mirror wills.

Flugelhorn

It sounds like the OP expected some external body would take over "managing the will & estate" after the death of the individual.
But it isn't like that - apart from HMRC it is very light touch from official bodies and the family etc just get on with it.

SevenOfNine

unholyangel wrote: »

I agree they should be reviewed periodically and updated, its just good practice. We know that sometimes people don't though - sometimes for circumstances out of their control.

Neither of you would disinherit your own children, but can you say the same for any potential unknown partner? There could be a mental deterioration of the surviving spouse - either so they lose capacity or they become forgetful and forget to do important things like update their will. Or they could get remarried and then divorced with a settlement to pay their ex. However I do appreciate the difference between possibility and probability, I was just pointing out that there are various risks involved with mirror wills.

All very valid points.

As far as paragraph one goes, you can lead people to water but you can't make them drink. :wall::wall: They are the ones whose relatives pop up on here complaining.

As for the second paragraph, there are lots of 'what if' situations. What if the surviving spouse needs a care home? Yes, perhaps that is the intention of a life interest in deceased spouse's will leaving their 1/2 of everything (or the home anyway) to the offspring, protecting it from that possibility. But that doesn't help the surviving spouse buy the best out there & at the end of the day he/she AND deceased spouse built up those assets together.

What if offspring fall out with surviving parent or isn't particularly close or attentive towards them (we all live locally, but my 2 brothers don't bother overly much with our mother who is 91 & increasingly frail). What if offspring divorce, what counts into his/her assets for splitting. I'm not saying the parents house would have to be sold, but offspring may have to find that tied up value from elsewhere to share with the ex.

So many variables for/against this or that. Was it Mojisola who said "it's difficult". Very true. We've recently switched to basic mirror wills leaving all to each other because in the last 33 months our older son inherited £273k followed by £40k, & his 2 children (our grandsons) inherited £50k each. We, for the time being, are safe in the knowledge that our little family are already well taken care off, so after 42 years of marriage we must ensure we look after each other first & foremost. Though our biggest asset, the house, is already set up for a life interest type will & we'll be reviewing regularly.

Keep_pedalling

unholyangel wrote: »

I agree they should be reviewed periodically and updated, its just good practice. We know that sometimes people don't though - sometimes for circumstances out of their control.

Neither of you would disinherit your own children, but can you say the same for any potential unknown partner? There could be a mental deterioration of the surviving spouse - either so they lose capacity or they become forgetful and forget to do important things like update their will. Or they could get remarried and then divorced with a settlement to pay their ex. However I do appreciate the difference between possibility and probability, I was just pointing out that there are various risks involved with mirror wills.

There are always risks in these situations, and no will will cover divorce (for that trusts should be considered) Not making a new will in advance of a second marriage would be nuts as you risk dying intestate, and whatever risks there are with wills, the risks associated with intestacy are far higher, which is why the OP is talking rubbish.

Keep_pedalling

SevenOfNine wrote: »

All very valid points.

As far as paragraph one goes, you can lead people to water but you can't make them drink. :wall::wall: They are the ones whose relatives pop up on here complaining.

As for the second paragraph, there are lots of 'what if' situations. What if the surviving spouse needs a care home? Yes, perhaps that is the intention of a life interest in deceased spouse's will leaving their 1/2 of everything (or the home anyway) to the offspring, protecting it from that possibility. But that doesn't help the surviving spouse buy the best out there & at the end of the day he/she AND deceased spouse built up those assets together.

What if offspring fall out with surviving parent or isn't particularly close or attentive towards them (we all live locally, but my 2 brothers don't bother overly much with our mother who is 91 & increasingly frail). What if offspring divorce, what counts into his/her assets for splitting. I'm not saying the parents house would have to be sold, but offspring may have to find that tied up value from elsewhere to share with the ex.

So many variables for/against this or that. Was it Mojisola who said "it's difficult". Very true. We've recently switched to basic mirror wills leaving all to each other because in the last 33 months our older son inherited £273k followed by £40k, & his 2 children (our grandsons) inherited £50k each. We, for the time being, are safe in the knowledge that our little family are already well taken care off, so after 42 years of marriage we must ensure we look after each other first & foremost. Though our biggest asset, the house, is already set up for a life interest type will & we'll be reviewing regularly.

Congrats on the 42 years, we are just a few weeks away from the same.

gettingtheresometime

When my mum wrote her will she asked my sister and I to read the draft to see if we could think of any 'what if' situations.


My FIL, on the other hand, wrote a will with the best of intentions but the law of unintended consequences came into play which means potentially OH may never see the inheritance that we know FIL & MIL would have wanted him to have.


I plan to ask a good friend of mine to have a look at the draft of my new will (when I get around to it!) to see if she can see any 'what ifs' situations.

Keep_pedalling

gettingtheresometime wrote: »

When my mum wrote her will she asked my sister and I to read the draft to see if we could think of any 'what if' situations.


My FIL, on the other hand, wrote a will with the best of intentions but the law of unintended consequences came into play which means potentially OH may never see the inheritance that we know FIL & MIL would have wanted him to have.


I plan to ask a good friend of mine to have a look at the draft of my new will (when I get around to it!) to see if she can see any 'what ifs' situations.

I really hope you are not going to DIY this. I am not saying solisitors do not make mistakes, but they make far less than an DIYer will, and there is a route for legal redress if a solisitor fowls up.