Gladstones Letter Before Claim Oct 2018 - How should I respond?

U414830

Good luck for tomorrow

StubbornGoat

WE WON! :j:

I say "we" because Coupon-Mad came along too, so this victory is shared with her. And to those of you all who helped on this. This victory is yours too.

I will be doing a full write up later, (and will be getting the full transcript of the hearing too).. but first I will be celebrating with my family. :beer:

What a great day!

Le_Kirk

Nice one! That wasn't fair on the claimant, I bet they were shaking in their boots when C-m walked into the court!

beamerguy

Well done you and coupon-mad :beer::T

I do enjoy Gladstones being whooped in court:rotfl:

Coupon-mad

Great fun! A morning well spent.

A challenge about the rep's RoA was knocked back, as partly expected, but the fact we were challenging the young lady's RoA seemed to rattle her.

She tried objecting to me being the lay rep, mumbling that she hadn't been informed.

The lady Judge responded harshly: ''well, you've been informed now!''

The legal rep squirmed a bit. I'll leave the floor for the OP write up a court report.

ANOTHER ONE BITES THE DUST!


:T

U414830

StubbornGoat Well done on your win!

Coupon- mad you are a star.

Umkomaas

Well done SG and CM. Formidable combo. :T

StubbornGoat

So here's my write up on today's VICTORY... (please excuse the report if it seems all muddled.. I am going to try get everything down as clear as possible.. but it's all still dancing around my brain at the moment!):rotfl:

The hearing was scheduled to be at 10am, so I aimed to get to court for 9:30am. After finally finding somewhere to park at 9:35am (thanks to CM finding a space right outside, and standing in it preventing anyone else from taking it!)..

We headed inside, past security and signed in.

We went upstairs to the waiting room (which was strange seeing as the room we ended up having the hearing in was downstairs), sat and chatted for what seemed like 5 minutes, but was in fact 2 hours (the hearing was running considerably late). Time flies when you're having fun eh? . Though that sense of excitement soon drifted to panic as we had both parked in spaces that only allowed for 2 hours with no return within 2 hours (it would be ironic to get a ticket, whilst waiting to fight another ticket!)... Anyway, we managed to grab the usher and ask how long it will be before we're called. We were told 20 minutes so had enough time to go to our cars, and basically switched parking spots (I went in her space, and CM in mine - Genius thinking from CM).. Having done that, and caught our breath! we were then called in.

It was our time and I was pumped with adrenaline, through the genuine EXCITEMENT of putting across everything I had researched and spent hours upon hours prepping for....

As soon as I go in, I looked around and saw that it was pretty much a small classroom. Said Hello to the judge, and took my seat. CM then followed, with the ELMS agent last in (BTW we had briefly met the agent outside .. asked who she was and challenged her Right of Audience - she gave us a piece of paper to read through which said she had rights... we left it there, and thought best to see what the judge thought)

Anyway.. back to where I was...

We started off by explaining that CM would be my Lay Rep, to which the Judge replied saying that she did not know why I needed a lay rep, because looking through everything I had submitted, she said it was so well put together that it showed clear knowledge of the law and at a very high level etc... and that "unless the documents were written by [CM] that she did not understand why [CM] was there" - I immediately thought "well, CM DID actually write half the stuff I was presenting, so yes - she did deserve to be there! "

Having challenged the agents Right of Audience, the judge was satisfied to allow both CM and the ELMS agent to be there. But the agent then challenged it (CM being the Lay Rep) saying that they had not received any notification of CM being the Lay Rep... to which the judge barked back at her "well you're being told now!"... the agent then sat quietly, not having anything to say back. I loved that. It was a clear sign that the judge wasn't going to be too friendly with the agent.

So off we went...

[at this point, I was busy getting all my papers from my file and neatly putting them in front of me, with so much paper, turning the table white and making me feel bad for the trees!]


Despite deciding outside in the waiting room, that our first point to raise was to be the signage (and the lack of it) the Judge handed CM the gauntlet by raising the POFA first and commenting that the Defendant had tried to name the driver & been refused.

So CM took that cue and ran with the POFA first, as they were claiming against me, when it should have been my wife (as I told them early on that it was her that was driving)...

The agent then raised the point that I never gave my address when I mentioned in an earlier email to UKCPM that I was not the driver, but CM then said that I was not given a chance because I was told by UKCPM to go speak to DRPL. The judge also added that in later emails by me to UKCPM and Gladstones.. that I did give my address (something neither CM or me noticed when we went through my paperwork). The judge had clearly spent the time looking through my paperwork prior to the hearing!

It then came apparent that the judge had made up her mind, that they were pursuing the wrong person and the claim was swiftly dismissed! The agent challenged it, but the judge was having none of it and her decision was final.

I was then asked about costs, to which I started talking (not knowing that I was still unable to address the judge).. so CM then explained everything I had written down with regards to why the claimant had behaved wholly unreasonable - and the judge basically agreed with everything that CM said and agreed that I would get my ordinary costs of £61.20. She also went on to say that she was THAT close to awarding me the total costs of £1552.. but after the agent argued that they only received the Costs Application via email on Friday (4 days before the hearing) that they were "ambushed". The judge agreed (although in my opinion, having only received Gladstones Witness Statement on the 3rd.. that meant I could only have submitted the Skeleton Argument along with the Costs Application 4 days prior (as I could not argue against their WS having received it late). That was disappointing.. HOWEVER having said that, the judge then added that, albeit unusual, she would 'add a recital' to the Order, so as to document that she had found the Claimant's conduct to be unreasonable and that they had no cause of action, and that the £1552 costs on the indemnity basis, could be more appropriately sought as a counter-claim instead. And that she had only refused costs on the day due to the timeline of serving the costs schedule.

Therefore having been given that opportunity, I now plan to claim against them (how the tables have turned!) with my new partner in (fighting) crime! :cool::cool:

So finally; thank you all again for the help I have received during all this. I am super grateful and look forward to paying it forward now that I know so much more.

But special appreciation for the star of the show, Coupon-Mad. Without her, I feel I would have done ok... but WITH her, the opposition didn't stand a chance.

Side note: To me, it's not about the money (although making UKCPM pay does feel good - and one of the reasons I plan on counter-claiming - the other being that I had so much fun) - But also throughout everything I have read on here, I feel I have taken away some invaluable lessons, which will allow me to help others and slowly but surely put these scam merchants out of business.

Redx

well done


not only have you learned valuable lessons, but this thread will help many others learn those lessons and fight these par@sites


its also worth knowing that costs orders need to be completed and submitted much sooner than previously thought


good luck with your counter claim and I hope you get the dosh, because they deserve it due to the misery they inflict on others

Coupon-mad

I think we should now start telling people to file & serve their (HIGH, hundreds or more - let's go for it in most Gladstones/BW Legal cases!) costs schedules at WS stage with the evidence bundle.

They could always update it before the hearing if more costs arise due to late submissions, supplementary WS that needed to be read & responded to, etc.

We really were ''this close'' (Judge's words) to getting £1552 costs.

This was case no. F8GF991P, before District Judge Ellis.