Parking in own space - Gladstoned

[Deleted User]

Johnersh wrote: »

If you've been ordered to pay "X" rather than "X with costs to be assessed" then X is the limit of the liability.

It was the former, so only £200 (!) to pay.


However, after more detailed discussions with the defendant we are now seriously considering taking this to appeal - if we are able to do so. The decision, and the overall approach of the judge, were so outrageous that we just can't let it rest.


So, despite the fact that the judge refused leave to appeal, is there still an opportunity to do so, and what are the first steps? If we go ahead, at this early stage any background information about the process would be gratefully received.

Le_Kirk

This is moving into the realms of legal advice rather than parking ticket advice, suggest legal beagles would be a better place for you to ask that question - unless Johnersh replies.

[Deleted User]

Yes, you can apply to appeal on the relevant form, having been denied permission in the first instance.

No, it is not guaranteed that permission will be given

Be aware that you are NOT appealing the result in the hope of a better outcome. You need to advance a technical argument as to why the judge fell into error. That will usually be a failure to consider material information or an error in applying the law.

I try not to provide advice, but rather generic thoughts of general application. Think carefully on this and, if necessary, take proper advice.

[Deleted User]

Johnersh wrote: »

Yes, you can apply to appeal on the relevant form, having been denied permission in the first instance.

No, it is not guaranteed that permission will be given

Be aware that you are NOT appealing the result in the hope of a better outcome. You need to advance a technical argument as to why the judge fell into error. That will usually be a failure to consider material information or an error in applying the law.

I try not to provide advice, but rather generic thoughts of general application. Think carefully on this and, if necessary, take proper advice.

That's fine. Thanks. Just one question though - almost advice I suppose: is the fact that the judge had the full dossier from Gladstones, but did not have our witness statement, cause for complaint? Clearly the court admin function had not furnished him with the requisite documents, but he proceeded to make a judgement, regardless. He asked to see just one document from our pack - which was duly handed over, but all the references to previous cases, together with our overall argument about primacy of contract and much more, was not considered.

Coupon-mad

Can you prove you sent the bundle to the court, and so kick into touch any suggestion of Post Office lost post?

What 'error in law' are you going to argue to support your request for leave to appeal, the fact that the Judge made an unjustified and incorrect presumption when he asked the question 'did you ever display a permit' when in fact the answer 'yes' related only to SUBSEQUENT dates after being stung by the PCN (which was purely a day when unloading was taking place to move in, and your WS & evidence covered all of this and included the very relevant and persuasive appeal case of Jopson v Homeguard, which was ignored or lost by the court?).

This costs £110 (or £120?) with the right application - ask the local court.

Also why not chat politely to the Usher and ask what happened to your bundle that day, did thy ever match it up to the file...ask them to look...what would be great if if they find it and can see it was there all the time and admit that to you.

Start by asking a general question about the cost of leave to appeal and the right form to use, get them on your side and chatty, then try to wheedle out some info about where that bundle went, was it misfiled?

[Deleted User]

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Can you prove you sent the bundle to the court, and so kick into touch any suggestion of Post Office lost post?

What 'error in law' are you going to argue to support your request for leave to appeal, the fact that the Judge made an unjustified and incorrect presumption when he asked the question 'did you ever display a permit' when in fact the answer 'yes' related only to SUBSEQUENT dates after being stung by the PCN (which was purely a day when unloading was taking place to move in, and your WS & evidence covered all of this and included the very relevant and persuasive appeal case of Jopson v Homeguard, which was ignored or lost by the court?).

This costs £110 (or £120?) with the right application - ask the local court.

Also why not chat politely to the Usher and ask what happened to your bundle that day, did thy ever match it up to the file...ask them to look...what would be great if if they find it and can see it was there all the time and admit that to you.

Start by asking a general question about the cost of leave to appeal and the right form to use, get them on your side and chatty, then try to wheedle out some info about where that bundle went, was it misfiled?

We have proof of postage for the bundle sent to the court. The defendant is speaking to the court this morning and hoping to speak directly to the usher, or another relevant person, to enquire as to how the judge could come to a conclusion without having access to our WS. He, the defendant, mentioned something about a complaint to the court concerning their processes. I'll update in due course.