Claiming for medical negligence.

Red-Squirrel_2

frannyj543 wrote: »

The fact is that she went in with what she believed was a heart attack. They said that her issues weren't heart related( albiet they had only done whatever checks can be done in 24 hours) and where starting to look towards a different direction.

Surely if there was something up at least one warning sign may have flashed up. To say it doesn't seem heart related to 12 hours later a heart attack is abit hard to believe.

An ECG measures the electrical activity in the heart and is a really really good way to find out how its working in just a few minutes. This would 100% have been done in A&E.

It sounds like you would really benefit from having everything talked through and explained so that you can understand what happened to your mum and start to make your peace with it. Definitely ask for this.

YoungBlueEyes

OP I'm sorry for your loss.
I can empathise a little with your situation. My father died recently of (I suspect) a heart attack. We don't know because he donated his body to medical science so there's no definitive answer.

I took him into hospital on the friday afternoon cos he was struggling to breathe despite just finishing a course of antibiotics. He had COPD but was basically fit and well. They admitted him and put him on an antibiotic drip. They spent days doing all kinds of tests but other than a chest infection in his beggered lungs he was fine.

On the Thursday when I went up he complained that his armpit was a bit hot and itchy. I told a nurse. They ran tests, he'd had a wee heart attack in the night but no cause for concern. They put it down to stress over being in hospital + too loud and busy (he was a gentle quiet soul) + unhappy at being prodded and poked + how hot the wards are.

They discharged him late Friday evening. He was much happier at home, I made him a good dinner and bathed him and he was fine.

At 0410 the next morning he buzzed me (we had walkie talkies). He couldn't speak, indicated he had back pain, and died in my arms. Less than 12 hours after the hospital said he was fine.

I believe that when your time is up there's nothing anybody can do. I don't know how many tests he had or how many people signed him off as being fine, it seemed like half the hospital was involved ha haa! They gave me some dispersible aspirin for him to start drinking the next day, but other than that there was no concern.

I've told you that so you can see I'm talking from first hand experience when I say this next (harsh) thing. You've said a few times that you're not looking to place blame, and you understand things can change quickly. But it isn't coming across like that. I know it's hard to lose someone so close, you want to know what's occurred and how it could have happened. But that doesn't mean the doctors and nurses could have prevented it. Even if there was another test they could have done or a tablet they should have started your mother on, it might not have made any difference. Science is pure miraculous in so many ways, but we don't know everything. Your mother and my father are two people that have....... slipped through the gaps in our knowledge.....? With my father I believe that his body was done and it 'switched off'.

Please think very carefully before starting a medical negligence claim. My half sister has spent months doing that very thing - she's spending a fortune and she has no more answers than we all did at the start. I think she's becoming fixated on the whole thing, and she's getting no peace from it, quite the opposite actually. It's doing everybody more harm than good.

Sometimes there isn't a definitive answer, or a specific thing that would mean your mother would still be here today. Doctors and nurses aren't infallible, nor are the tests/machines etc. But how could a negligence claim help you? Or help anyone? You say you don't want it to happen to someone else; they have internal procedures to ensure these things happen as infrequently as possible. They'll identify anything that could be improved upon and change the way they do things - they don't need outside help for that. Or say that there is a test the doctors didn't do - then what? What do you want to happen? An apology? Reprimanded? Sacked? How will that help the situation? Do you want to sue them? Have them up on manslaughter charges? Forcing the NHS to spend even more money on this sort of thing is truly not the answer.

A meeting will hopefully give you some answers so you can find a measure of peace with the whole thing. Good luck and I wish you all the best

System

Again thanks for all replies.

We have a meeting with the hospital at the end of September. Hopefully this will shed some light on the matter.

My aim isn't to get anyone sacked or get someone in trouble. It won't bring my mother back nor will it make a huge difference.

However it will be nice to be spoken to on a personal level to hear what happened in the lead up. What (if anything was missed). Why ECG tests didn't pick anything up. Why they were concerned with the liver when in fact the liver had no problems post mortem. Again was entirely heart related. While I understand the heart can cause issues elsewhere a fully operational healthy working heart won't cause problems with the liver. However one that wasn't functioning correctly may.

Because in life whether you are a doctor or a surgeon or a shelf stacker in Tescos we all have to explain our actions and decisions. I haven't ever spoken to anyone yet to truly understand how someone has check ups 3 weeks before. Goes into hospital, 24 hours seems ok and 1 hour after I leave the hospital I get the dreaded call.

Nobody in life is unaccountable whether science and the human body is complex. They have a hard job but they have procedures that need to be followed. I am not bitter, I am not angry I simply want an explanation which I'm more than entitled to get considering the build up of events.

I want to hear why they decided it wasn't a heart issue during them 24 hours despite us saying she has always had heart related problems. They done the tests and said nothing irregular showed up however clearly there was something up.

That's all.

Yorkshireman99

frannyj543 wrote: »

Again thanks for all replies.

We have a meeting with the hospital at the end of September. Hopefully this will shed some light on the matter.

My aim isn't to get anyone sacked or get someone in trouble. It won't bring my mother back nor will it make a huge difference.

However it will be nice to be spoken to on a personal level to hear what happened in the lead up. What (if anything was missed). Why ECG tests didn't pick anything up. Why they were concerned with the liver when in fact the liver had no problems post mortem. Again was entirely heart related. While I understand the heart can cause issues elsewhere a fully operational healthy working heart won't cause problems with the liver. However one that wasn't functioning correctly may.

Because in life whether you are a doctor or a surgeon or a shelf stacker in Tescos we all have to explain our actions and decisions. I haven't ever spoken to anyone yet to truly understand how someone has check ups 3 weeks before. Goes into hospital, 24 hours seems ok and 1 hour after I leave the hospital I get the dreaded call.

Nobody in life is unaccountable whether science and the human body is complex. They have a hard job but they have procedures that need to be followed. I am not bitter, I am not angry I simply want an explanation which I'm more than entitled to get considering the build up of events.

I want to hear why they decided it wasn't a heart issue during them 24 hours despite us saying she has always had heart related problems. They done the tests and said nothing irregular showed up however clearly there was something up.

That's all.

You seem to have missed the points made by several posters. The human body is an incredibly complex organism and does not always behave in a conveniently predictable manner. However experienced the medical staff my be they cannot always be certain what is happening and take appropriate action. Medicine is not a perfect science and even the most experienced and skilled staff simply dont always get it right. You seeme determined to find a culprit when there may not be one. Sometimes with the best will in the world the patient dies. The general public seem to think that heart massage resuscitation is magic solution. In fact, even if the equipment and skilled staff are to hand only a third of patients survive, by all means have the meeting but don.t expect the answer you want to hear.

relaxtwotribes

frannyj543 wrote: »

They done the tests and said nothing irregular showed up however clearly there was something up.

You say "clearly" yet you have not specified what better qualifications you have than the medical staff to make such a categorical statement. I doubt that the explanation you are seeking will satisfy you; you appear to be in the blame game. Good luck with that.

pearl123

Yorkshireman99 wrote: »

You seem to have missed the points made by several posters. The human body is an incredibly complex organism and does not always behave in a conveniently predictable manner. However experienced the medical staff my be they cannot always be certain what is happening and take appropriate action. Medicine is not a perfect science and even the most experienced and skilled staff simply dont always get it right. You seeme determined to find a culprit when there may not be one. Sometimes with the best will in the world the patient dies. The general public seem to think that heart massage resuscitation is magic solution. In fact, even if the equipment and skilled staff are to hand only a third of patients survive, by all means have the meeting but don.t expect the answer you want to hear.

100% agree. Sadly, your Mum died at a young age. Without wishing to sound partitioning there are several stages of grief one of which is anger.
Could you be angry that something has gone wrong. Angry that Mum has gone? I remember being angry at my Fathers treatment in hospital but mine was all focused upon hygiene standards. A friend reacted very similarly regarding her Mum but she realised several weeks later that her reaction was part of the grieving process.

System

I am not seeking 1 person to blame. For me that doesn't resolve anything.

Maybe I'm seeking answers regarding procedures and protocols. Is that really a bad thing? To ask the NHS why something wasn't detected?

I understand at any moment the body can stop working. So please do not insult my intelligence when I've made that perfect clear.

I think from my posts i certainly don't come across angry. While the hospital in question have dodged the meeting for the past 14 months I haven't once contacted them. I just waited.

It has literally taken what will be 15.5 months to have a sit down with them just to understand what procedures where taken and how things can go wrong. That's all I'm looking.

I deliberately put the title as what I did basically to hook readers in. I am in no position to be trying to take the NHS to court. It's a waste of time and effort.

It's funny how some people commenting seem more angry with me asking the questions than what I am having never ever gotten an explanation.

I'm not saying my mum didn't die from natural causes etc etc. I know she did. I just want it explained to me what happened those 24 hours, the exact tests that were done and why they thought it wasn't heart related only for it to be heart related.

That is all I'm looking someone of a professional background to say we did x,y,z the results indicated a,b,c.

After that I can accept it. I have already accepted my mum is no longer here. But I would just like abit of clarity regarding the build up to the day and the actions taken.

As I repeat we asked the hospital for a brief enquire into what happened both in the examination 3 weeks before and when she was brought into hospital. That was 14 months ago and to date nothing. Is it that hard for someone to give us abit of clarity? Should it take that long?

Many of yous have been in the same situation. Maybe things were as unclear for you and rather than ask the question you accepted it. I just want it for abit of clarity. It doesn't change a thing but if a professional person can sit me down and explain that would be good enough for me.

And I certainly don't think that is too much to ask. We are talking about a human life after.

lincroft1710

frannyj543 wrote: »

Why ECG tests didn't pick anything up.

They done the tests and said nothing irregular showed up however clearly there was something up.

Having had several ECGs, they will indicate if there is a problem with the heart. If the ECG showed the heart working normally, then there was no reason to suspect it wasn't. Even blood tests can't always indicate that there has been a heart attack, just suggest the likelihood or otherwise.

troubleinparadise

People reply to what is posted on the forum - so don’t be surprised if some replies might seem challenging. You say your title was to hook people into your thread - no need to do that, people will reply if they have something to offer, but you have set yourself up for the tone of some replies.

Does your hospital run a Patient Advice and Liaison Service (PALS)? That is the normal route to take to follow through queries about treatment, explanations, complaints.

You say there was a post-mortem, and that you have been asking questions for 18 months. What form have your questions taken - via PALS, in writing, on the phone, speaking to staff?

You can only get replies based on the information given, and it may not be what you want to hear, or perhaps people can’t w rite from experience. But in this case there have been several replies from experience but you don’t seem to have listened.

Go to that meeting prepared, and listen to the answers.

Yorkshireman99

troubleinparadise wrote: »

People reply to what is posted on the forum - so don!!!8217;t be surprised if some replies might seem challenging. You say your title was to hook people into your thread - no need to do that, people will reply if they have something to offer, but you have set yourself up for the tone of some replies.

Does your hospital run a Patient Advice and Liaison Service (PALS)? That is the normal route to take to follow through queries about treatment, explanations, complaints.

You say there was a post-mortem, and that you have been asking questions for 18 months. What form have your questions taken - via PALS, in writing, on the phone, speaking to staff?

You can only get replies based on the information given, and it may not be what you want to hear, or perhaps people can!!!8217;t w rite from experience. But in this case there have been several replies from experience but you don!!!8217;t seem to have listened.

Go to that meeting prepared, and listen to the answers.

100% spot on! Whn I had occasion to contact PALS on behalf of my mother our queries were dealt with pronptly and efficiently. The senior radiologist in person went to great lengths to explain why the initial Xray did not initially reveal the exact problem. As it happened the hospital's quality control system picked up the errror and appropriate steps were taken to have the ankle rexamined. In fact in needed no addidional treatment. My advice to the OP would be to drop the confrontational approach and ask polite questions in a civilised manner. No medic wants to lose a patient and to imply. as the OP has, negligence without knowing the facts is not going to help matters.