Brexit the economy and house prices part 6

Lungboy

buglawton wrote: »

So it would only cost one eighth of our annual tithe to the EU to build an independent system? Bargain!

We don't give them £40bil a year, that's the one off divorce payment .

Lornapink

Theophile wrote: »

More obfuscation. More lies. When will it ever stop.

The assertion and link you refer to as lies were provided by uber-Remainer Jonathan Freedland writing in the Guardian;

'There has been no unambiguous, tectonic shift in public opinion since June 2016. On the contrary, many of the grievances that fuelled the leave vote remain in place; the cry for help was ignored. The latest Deltapoll survey shows no deal beating remain by 52% to 48%. Think of it: even after all the warnings of grounded planes, lorry queues and medicine shortages, no deal – not just leave – winning by four points'.


https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/nov/30/brexit-gamble-second-vote-no-deal-risk

Arklight

buglawton wrote: »

There's talk of a cooperative plan with UK, Australia and NZ for a new GPS system. With so many experts happily living with their families in the UK, who worked on Galileo, they'd be very well placed to lead the tech, using all their experience to make the next system better and more cost-effective

I'm afraid those experts are already in the process of packing up and going where the expertise is needed. Which isn't here.

There are already 4 global GPS systems in operation and the Chinese are about to expand theirs globally which will make 5. They are all owned by superpowers or giant regional powers.

The notion that some broke remnant of the Commonwealth is going to build a 6th system for military reasons, when all of it's constituent parts are militarily tiny and unable to deploy without the US (which incidentally hates Galileo and tried to block it but couldn't due to the EU being too large for it to bully) is complete fantasy.

But that's what Brexit is all about isn't it? Epic self delusion. Lashings of ginger beer, comedy 1930s politicians boiling with anger about swarthy foreigners with turbans taking the women and plucky Britain what never did nothing to no one trying to survive in the midst of it all.

Moby

Lornapink wrote: »

The assertion and link you refer to as lies were provided by uber-Remainer Jonathan Freedland writing in the Guardian;

'There has been no unambiguous, tectonic shift in public opinion since June 2016. On the contrary, many of the grievances that fuelled the leave vote remain in place; the cry for help was ignored. The latest Deltapoll survey shows no deal beating remain by 52% to 48%. Think of it: even after all the warnings of grounded planes, lorry queues and medicine shortages, no deal – not just leave – winning by four points'.


https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/nov/30/brexit-gamble-second-vote-no-deal-risk

I put Theophiles response and correction of your error up again...just in case you missed it last time:-

This is a misrepresentation of the poll's findings, focusing on a subset of the transferable vote preference analysis. No Deal is comprehensively the least favoured option.

http://www.deltapoll.co.uk/steve-fisher-condorcet

Moby

Arklight wrote: »

I'm afraid those experts are already in the process of packing up and going where the expertise is needed. Which isn't here.

There are already 4 global GPS systems in operation and the Chinese are about to expand theirs globally which will make 5. They are all owned by superpowers or giant regional powers.

The notion that some broke remnant of the Commonwealth is going to build a 6th system for military reasons, when all of it's constituent parts are militarily tiny and unable to deploy without the US (which incidentally hates Galileo and tried to block it but couldn't due to the EU being too large for it to bully) is complete fantasy.

But that's what Brexit is all about isn't it? Epic self delusion. Lashings of ginger beer, comedy 1930s politicians boiling with anger about swarthy foreigners with turbans taking the women and plucky Britain what never did nothing to no one trying to survive in the midst of it all.

:rotfl: ....and lots of thinking about..........

sevenhills

Lornapink wrote: »

'There has been no unambiguous, tectonic shift in public opinion since June 2016. On the contrary, many of the grievances that fuelled the leave vote remain in place; the cry for help was ignored. The latest Deltapoll survey shows no deal beating remain by 52% to 48%. Think of it: even after all the warnings of grounded planes, lorry queues and medicine shortages, no deal – not just leave – winning by four points'.

As the prime minister steps up efforts to sell her blueprint, a survey found that 46 per cent of people would prefer to remain in the bloc compared to 37 per cent who would choose Ms May's deal, if asked to pick in a new public vote.


I also did my own poll on facebook, with a no-deal or remain scenario and there was a swing towards remain compared to a previous poll that I did in 2016.



https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-news-theresa-may-deal-eu-remain-second-referendum-survation-opinion-poll-a8655411.html



It found that 25 per cent thought Ms May's deal was the best outcome while 32 per cent opted for no-deal scenario and 41 per cent believed the UK remaining in the EU was the better route.


https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-poll-remain-leave-eu-theresa-may-deal-vote-referendum-economy-a8659736.html

Thrugelmir

sevenhills wrote: »

It found that 25 per cent thought Ms May's deal was the best outcome while 32 per cent opted for no-deal scenario and 41 per cent believed the UK remaining in the EU was the better route.

Seems to be an acceptance of leaving the EU. Irrespective of any previous view. People are tired of the endless debate. Which isn't taking the country forward in any way. While the EU seems to be heading for more challenging times itself with or without the UK.

cogito

Arklight wrote: »

I'm afraid those experts are already in the process of packing up and going where the expertise is needed. Which isn't here.

There are already 4 global GPS systems in operation and the Chinese are about to expand theirs globally which will make 5. They are all owned by superpowers or giant regional powers.

The notion that some broke remnant of the Commonwealth is going to build a 6th system for military reasons, when all of it's constituent parts are militarily tiny and unable to deploy without the US (which incidentally hates Galileo and tried to block it but couldn't due to the EU being too large for it to bully) is complete fantasy.

But that's what Brexit is all about isn't it? Epic self delusion. Lashings of ginger beer, comedy 1930s politicians boiling with anger about swarthy foreigners with turbans taking the women and plucky Britain what never did nothing to no one trying to survive in the midst of it all.

Why would we be unable to deploy our own GPS system without the Americans? The EU uses Russian rockets which, incidentally, launched a couple of Galileo satellites into the wrong orbit rendering them useless for their intended purpose.

Fact is, that Galileo is 20 years on from its conception and is based upon technology which is somewhat out of date. Advances in technology mean that it would be feasible for the UK to develop its own GPS system at a fraction of the cost of Galileo.

Don't let a few facts get in the way of your hatred of the UK.

Arklight

cogito wrote: »

Why would we be unable to deploy our own GPS system without the Americans? The EU uses Russian rockets which, incidentally, launched a couple of Galileo satellites into the wrong orbit rendering them useless for their intended purpose.

Fact is, that Galileo is 20 years on from its conception and is based upon technology which is somewhat out of date. Advances in technology mean that it would be feasible for the UK to develop its own GPS system at a fraction of the cost of Galileo.

Don't let a few facts get in the way of your hatred of the UK.

No it won't. And don't let your blind support for Brexit get in the way of reality.

As I stated, the rationale for developing a bespoke GPS is military. Any of the 5 systems in operation now can lock out other countries and civilian users when they wish. Which is why the Chinese and the Russians aren't using NAVSTAR.

The Americans opposed Galileo because they didn't want an alternative to NAVSTAR that they couldn't turn off.

If the UK could develop a system that the Americans couldn't blast out of orbit then it probably would sell very well, but as it is it would just be another bunch of satellites orbiting around to guide our 1 aircraft carrier, 74 other operational ships, and 70,000 man and woman army.

Incidentally none of this (comparatively tiny) military machine can project power outside of our own borders without US support anyway. Which makes duplicating a GPS system fairly pointless when schools don't have enough money, family services are in crisis, councils can't house the homeless, and the NHS is on the brink of being sold off .

It's all moot anyway. Another silly Brexit pipe dream that will be kicked into the long grass as we try and adjust to how much worse off we will be as a country after next year.

Herzlos

cogito wrote: »

Why would we be unable to deploy our own GPS system without the Americans?

We can't deploy what's left of our military without US help, so we may as well use their GPS too.

I also doubt we'll be able to do anything better and cheaper than our share of Gallileo, especially if the talent moves. With less committees and people to keep happy we can probably move faster, but they already have a massive head start.