ParkingEye POPLA Hallsville Quarter, London

Quentin

buppa wrote: »

Thanks. Maybe I will offer them to pay just for the parking fee......


I found in a different topic regarding Civil Enforcement.......

Do you think they could drop the case before court hearing?
Also if it came to hearing, what do you think my chances are?

I am just considering options here. Maybe the best option is to make an offer or to pay, but maybe not.

Is there any sort of general defence I could you as:

You are involved with an entirely different animal than CEL!!

Parking Eye are the most litigious of the Ppcs!! An offer to now pay the parking fee won't work

Nor will using that post you quote as your defence!! (The suggestion in that post that complaining to your mobile could lead to the government closing them down in the new year is far too optimistic! Don't build any hopes at all on this being resolved like this!)

buppa

ok, so my only option at the moment is to contact the enforcement team and offer them £40 and see what they'll do?

What about the LBC should I respond to it by post concurrently?

Regarding the logo, I just assumed it's a company like RingGo - just a payment system or an operator.

Anyway, if my explanation does not work here, I doubt it will work in court. And if there are no other general legal arguments - such as landowner authority, entering into a contract, signage size etc, then what are my options?

Without any drama the situation looks like this:
1. Looking for a place to park
2. Seeing a parking sign (white P on blue background)
3. When entering the road to the parking there is a council parking sign (next to another P sign) saying evenings are free to park.
4. The council road is very narrow, with double yellow lines on both sides.
5. There is an entrance to the car park and there is not visible sign it's a private parking (there is one but on the left side of the road, not clearly visible from the drivers seat.
6. In the parking area there are many posts with signs with ParkingEye logo, and information about tariffs, but there is not clearly visible information this is a private parking. There is even a logo of Paybyphone app that is also used to pay for council parking.
7. Confused by the council parking sign and no clearly visible information it's a private parking, I decided to park my car there.

That's the story.
Photos of the locations can be found here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/3s0noeqkx51tdex/Parking1.pdf?dl=0

My thinking can be strange for some of you, but I have no much experience with private parking companies. Usually there is a big sign saying it's a private parking, visible gate, a fence, often an automatic bar, ect. And no council signs, next to the "private" signs.
I was very surprised, when I got the "ticket".

If there is not way to avoid paying for the "mistake", then I'll do.

Quentin

Are your initials **?

buppa

Why are you asking?

Umkomaas

buppa wrote: »

Why are you asking?

Open the link to your appeal and a name is emblazoned on the cover sheet.

None of the photos showing the PE signs are in the remotest bit helpful to your appeal.

Quentin

buppa wrote: »

Why are you asking?

A simple yes or no would have done!


Assuming it's yes then you need to know your name in full is shown in all the dropbox links posted in this thread

buppa

Thanks, already changed it.

So how do you suggest to write the appeal?
Saying more or less what I wrote above (points 1-7) with photos?
Or can I try to defend myself, saying that there was no contract (as they claim) or even it there was the contract is invalid due to a mistake (mistake of fact?)? Or any other legal grounds?

I can also ask them for more evidence - they only sent a black and white photo, taken at night, with clear VRN (on the PCN).
I was also not able to see the evidence sent to POPLA.

Coupon-mad

I was also not able to see the evidence sent to POPLA.

Email a SAR to PE's Data Protection Team (see their Privacy page) and ask for that data as you never saw it, and you are entitled to it.

Your main defence might be if the signs were pitch black at night, and illegible, in which case I'd want to see how they overcame that with POPLA evidence, if I were you.

And if there are no other general legal arguments - such as landowner authority, entering into a contract, signage size etc, then what are my options?

But all of those things DO go into a defence, as you have seen from all the other example defence we assume you've been reading.

I did NOT say you had not defence (you did) and I didn't say your only option was to make an offer! I answered your own despondent 'it's not worth taking a day off work and I have no defence' words (your words not mine):

It seems as non of the previously used defences apply to my case. I mean, I could try to repeat what I already wrote in POPLA appeal, but probably it will not work.

... by being pragmatic, if that was your feeling:

If appearing at a hearing is not cost effective and you have little in the way of defence, then I suggest emailing the Enforcement Team...{with an offer}.

You were the one saying you had no defence, and wouldn't attend a hearing.

Without any drama the situation looks like this:
1. Looking for a place to park
2. Seeing a parking sign (white P on blue background)
3. When entering the road to the parking there is a council parking sign (next to another P sign) saying evenings are free to park.
4. The council road is very narrow, with double yellow lines on both sides.
5. There is an entrance to the car park and there is not visible sign it's a private parking (there is one but on the left side of the road, not clearly visible from the drivers seat.
6. In the parking area there are many posts with signs with ParkingEye logo, and information about tariffs, but there is not clearly visible information this is a private parking. There is even a logo of Paybyphone app that is also used to pay for council parking.
7. Confused by the council parking sign and no clearly visible information it's a private parking, I decided to park my car there.
That's the story.

Paybyphone is a company used by any parking firm or Council. no idea why people seek out car parks at night....why does anyone do this, rather than simply park on street somewhere, after restrictions ended...

Anyway, look at PE's Privacy page to fill out their GDPR data form asking for subject access to what you want them to show you.

buppa

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Email a SAR to PE's Data Protection Team (see their Privacy page) and ask for that data as you never saw it, and you are entitled to it.

Done

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Your main defence might be if the signs were pitch black at night, and illegible, in which case I'd want to see how they overcame that with POPLA evidence, if I were you.

It was at the end of May - it wasn't pitch black at 8pm. There are also lights at the parking.

Coupon-mad wrote: »

But all of those things DO go into a defence, as you have seen from all the other example defence we assume you've been reading.

I did NOT say you had not defence (you did) and I didn't say your only option was to make an offer! I answered your own despondent 'it's not worth taking a day off work and I have no defence' words (your words not mine):


... by being pragmatic, if that was your feeling:


You were the one saying you had no defence, and wouldn't attend a hearing.

What do you suggest me to write in my defence?
Beginning would be explaining the situation (similar to what's in POPLA appeal.
Then stating that there was no contract or if there was it was invalid due to a mistake - confusing signs at the entry to the road (council sign next to their sign) and no clear sign at the entrance to the parking from the drivers seat.
Also can state that I didn't have a chance to view evidence sent to POPLA (by PE)

Regarding other points - I went to the parking one month later to have a look and take some photos and there were signs with tariffs, information about landowners authority and specifying a fine. Photo no 11 - https://www.dropbox.com/s/3s0noeqkx51tdex/Parking1.pdf?dl=0

Again - although the tariff signs were visible, assuming that it was a council parking free to park on Saturday (at 8pm) the parking tariff shouldn't apply.

Please give me a clear answer what defence can I use, based on the facts stated above.

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Paybyphone is a company used by any parking firm or Council. no idea why people seek out car parks at night....why does anyone do this, rather than simply park on street somewhere, after restrictions ended...

Because I was convinced it was a public parking and free to park at 8pm on Saturday. And there was no clear sign at the entrance to the parking. It was also next to a main road. I didn't seek out a car park at night - it was next to the road and clearly visible. There was no single yellow line in sight on any nearby roads.

buppa

Hi,

This is my reply I am going to send to them.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/k1zriwd29fojneg/AACfWwA0FGRlrc5vTH89BuTka?dl=0

Please let me know if you have any suggestions.

Thank you