Overstay Guidance

momoneh

Context is a retail park with many shops. Driver was onsite shopping. Free parking was for three hours but we are told that the driver overstayed. I have read the FAQ and stickies and have an idea of how to proceed using the template and mentioning clause 13 of the BPA CoP but was curious as to whether shopping receipts will be useful or not.

The timeline is as follows:

Entering site: 16:45:36
1st receipt: 16:58:57
2nd receipt: 20:00:03
Leaving site: 20:04:43

My thoughts are that the receipts show that the car was parked for just over three hours and so the driver wasn't looking for a space or taking time to read signage, ie with reference to reasonable grace periods, and so it wouldn't be of interest to include these in any appeal.

But should they be included in any complaints to the retailers?

Another thought: if one moves their car part way through the time period does the clock stop for the time it takes to repark?

Redx

use 1 out of the 2 receipts to prove that OCCUPANT (S) OF THE VEHICLE were patron(s) and a short note to state that the pcn should therefore be cancelled (and add copies or pics , not originals)

do NOT reveal who was driving whilst writing extra bits in

check the relevant CoP for grace periods allowed , typically 10 minutes either side of a parking period and add a paragraph about that if the "overstay" was less than say 20 minutes in total (clause #13) - this is the best defence argument especially if they have followed POFA2012

use ALL receipts to complain to retailers or Managing Agents and add a note that under GDPR they must NOT share this data with the PPC

no , moving the vehicle onsite from one place to another does not help at all, as its the total time on site that they check, so moving the vehicle within the premises is irrelevant

it may be relevant if the vehicle left site completely and then re-entered and pasrked again- making 2 visits , not one

Umkomaas

Which parking company? Advice can vary depending on which one you're dealing with.

momoneh

Interesting - I didn't realise patronage made a difference.

My fear about the receipts however is that they might show that the occupants of the vehicle didn't use 10 mins each side. The second one at least does (4 mins to exit), so perhaps I should use the first receipt?

The BPA CoP doesn't state a specific time period, merely "reasonable". Is 10 mins each side an industry given?

@Umkomaas the company is Smart Parking (which I saw mentioned a few times in the forum). PS I recently went diving in Umkomaas.

Umkomaas

Smart Parking are one of the easier ones to beat. Do a forum search on 'Smart POPLA' and check out recent (past few months) successful appeals, to get you ready for that stage of the process once your initial appeal has been rejected. Plagiarise as appropriate.

HOW TO USE THE FORUM SEARCH FUNCTION:

Use the Forum Jump button (one near the top and one near bottom of this page) to get back to the forum thread list. Just above the threads, on the right, is a heading along a line, next to forum tools, called 'Search this Forum'. Put your key word(s) in and change the default search from 'Show Threads' to 'Show Posts'.

PS I recently went diving in Umkomaas.

A nice part of KZN, with quality diving (not my bag!).

Redx

momoneh wrote: »

Interesting - I didn't realise patronage made a difference.

My fear about the receipts however is that they might show that the occupants of the vehicle didn't use 10 mins each side. The second one at least does (4 mins to exit), so perhaps I should use the first receipt?

The BPA CoP doesn't state a specific time period, merely "reasonable". Is 10 mins each side an industry given?

@Umkomaas the company is Smart Parking (which I saw mentioned a few times in the forum). PS I recently went diving in Umkomaas.

check the jan 2018 BPA CoP as its been amended


and the fact that an occupnat of the vehicle was still shopping whilst the driver was getting ready to leave or had already left the car park is a factor, as the receipts only prove an occupant was shopping at certain times, not that the driver broke any rules


think of a taxi driver dropping people off and leaving whilst they shop , the shopper is on site longer than a driver


personally , I would use both receipts and quote the BPA CoP 2018 clause #13 at them

momoneh

Thank you both for the replies. I have checked the latest BPA CoP and as stated it specifies 10 mins to process entry and 10 mins to leave.

I have also as advised done a search on Smart POPLA and resulting threads, but suspect I am confusing myself.

Is all and any "bespoke" action to be taken at the POPLA appeals phase (ie, just send the template to Smart now and wait for the auto reject)?

Or is the expectation that a crafted appeal to Smart with clause 13 reference and both receipts is the slam dunk that needs to be worked on? If not then why send more than the template?

Umkomaas

An initial appeal to any parking company rarely sees a cancellation. Parking charges are their only income, so why would they cancel? No profit in cancellations. You're angling for a popla Code - adding anything of your own will have no positive impact, and may blow some of your toes off if any 'I, me, myself' starts to creep in to the addition.

Quentin

Send the template appeal as is

It's designed to get a popla code

twhitehousescat

Thank you both for the replies. I have checked the latest BPA CoP and as stated it specifies 10 mins to process entry and 10 mins to leave.


Entering site: 16:45:36
1st receipt: 16:58:57
2nd receipt: 20:00:03
Leaving site: 20:04:43

my maths is rusty tonight , but I get that to be 19 mins and 7 seconds

in which case they have broken the BPA code of conduct and asked the DVLA for your indo incorrectly

Redx

in which case state that fact by adding it to the initial appeal, without blowing your toes off. there have been many such paragraphs written for smart and for PE plus other PPC,s over the last couple of years

if it gets to popla then that fact plus the other usual suspects are used in a "kitchen sink" appeal with clause #13 being the starter for 10 as I told you earlier. they cannot say they werent told if the initial keeper appeal clearly mentions it, plus add BOTH copies of receipts for good measure, as KEEPER or as an OCCUPANT of the vehicle. (vehicles can usually accomodate u to 5 occupants, including the actual owner, the keeper and the driver, plus 2 more passengers

we know them as "not so SMART" , for good reason