Doncaster airport vcs NTK

Busstop

Hi, wondering if you could put my mind to ease, I as keeper recently received a NTK for stopping in a restricted bus stop. I've been having a look at many posts and have come to the conclusion
1 that because this was a no stopping zone event there should be a 10 minute grace period for me which was not observed by the van
Or 2 because it was a bus stop on a public highway only the police can issue a fine for a breach of the rta
Furthermore either way vcs has acted outside of its remit and have broken the dpa in accessing my information
Am I correct and how should I proceed?

fisherjim

No you are way off the mark, have you read the neebies thread?

Umkomaas

Go to PePiPoo and search on Liverpool John Lennon Airport where VCS run an identical operation. Lots of information there for you to get yourself up to speed on 'stopping where stopping is prohibited' tickets, private roads, signage deficiencies, Airport byelaws, Road Traffic Enactments etc. Poster 'hexaflexagon' is prolific in taking LJLA and Liverpool Council to task on this.

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?act=SF&s=&f=60

But, be aware that VCS has issued at least two county court claims for LJLA 'stopping' cases in the past few months - previously unheard of, so there's new movement.

Busstop

Yes I read it, however as everything is open to interpretation asked the question.

Taken from said thread
Pursuing the keeper in trespass or bye-law cases, unless there is evidence that the keeper was the driver

So, in virtually all cases where the PPC has issued on non-relevant land, if the PPC does not know the driver, by applying to the DVLA for RK details, the PPC is breaking the law, and can be sued.

How long before the PPCs are flooded with counter-claims I wonder.

Unless court proceedings have already started, you should first write to the PPC explaining how it has misused your personal data, that this misuse is causing you significant financial loss or distress (or both) ...

But what if it isn't? What if you just want to give the PPC a rough time? Whether or not you are a robust character, they are still breaking the law. Can you not sue the for £1, (plus your Q.C.'s fees of course)?
Last edited by The Deep; 13-01-2017 at 7:50 AM.

Umkomaas

Taken from said thread

The Deep can do much of his musing aloud. His input in this particular instance isn't one most regulars would agree with.

The input suggests the employment of a QC to conduct what would be a high level legal test case, with absolutely no guarantee of success. Lose the case and your loss would be £1 - plus your QC's fees plus the other sides costs. :eek:

TD comes up with these suggestions because he's rich! Easy to risk other people's money.

Redx

Busstop wrote: »

Hi, wondering if you could put my mind to ease, I recently received a NTK for stopping in a restricted bus stop. I had pulled over to check if my friends plane had landed, a white van pulled up behind me and waited too, a couple of minutes later it flashed an orange light and passed me, only then did I see the signage on the side of it. I've been having a look at many posts and have come to the conclusion


1) that because this was a no stopping zone event there should be a 10 minute grace period for me which was not observed by the van


Or


2) because it was a bus stop on a public highway only the police can issue a fine for a breach of the rta


3) Furthermore either way vcs has acted outside of its remit and have broken the dpa in accessing my information


4) Am I correct

1) NO , because it does not say that in the IPC CoP


but yes, we believe a reasonable grace period should apply in all cases no matter who the PPC is or where it happened , the issue is what constitutes a reasonable grace period, especially in a "no stopping" area , hence the referrals to the LJLA threads and court cases


2) its not a public highway, its a private road on airport land where bylaws apply , same as on all the other similar airports like Newcastle , LJLA , Luton and Birmingham etc


it would be a penalty , not a "fine" , it the police enforced it, plus the AIRPORT would be the ones sending it as a penalty before the magistrates court, not VCS and not the police either



3) Possibly , but only the ICO could determine that if you put forward your case to them , so it depends on an ICO decision , plus it may be they would look at this under the GDPR and not the DPA , depending on which law they choose to use and why



4) NO , you were not correct


5) you proceed by following the IPC advice in the NEWBIES FAQ sticky thread, appeal as keeper, once , to VCS


then play tennis for 6 months until the bylaw issue times out


then play further tennis for another 5.5 years until the possibility of an MCOL times out

Busstop

Sorry, yes bylaws, I've read that many terms in the last couple of days I mixed up my response.
Been reading the 25 page thread on pepipoo, fascinating stuff but no conclusion as to what happened.
Given everything ive read about ipc is it even worth appealing?

waamo

It's not worth appealing to the IPC. Personally I would do an appeal to the ppc but in it query if byelaws apply.

If you can get them to state they are it helps you tremendously and I don't think it hurts if they deny it.

Redx

you should ALWAYS appeal any private parking ticket (if you dont wish to pay it) REGARDLESS , because a judge or magistrate may take a dim view of people who have ignored the letters, because court is a last resort


as mentioned above, use the template and query if this is a penalty or a private parking charge notice (never use the legal word "fine")

the IAS is a waste of time, so no second stage appeal

the letter tennis is all about the lack of a suitable ADR , as you will see from ongoing INDIGO RAILWAY threads (again where bylaws apply and popla has been ruled out by indigo and the BPA)

in theory MCOL is not for non-relevant land like airports and railways and ports, so until there are suitable outcomes on any court cases involving airports and railways and ports, you wont get definitive answers

Umkomaas

Been reading the 25 page thread on pepipoo, fascinating stuff but no conclusion as to what happened.

Still ongoing - hexaflexagon won't let it go, but there are gaps of seeming inactivity.

It's a long game being played. Sometimes what we want can't be delivered as quickly as we'd like!

Busstop

Appeal made by email and screenshot taken. They have drop down boxes to try and make people admit they were the driver, there are none which state denial of liability which leaves only 2 choices to use, my car was not in the car park or there was no signage.