John lewis refusing refund under distance sel regs

bobwilson

Hi,

I've not been in this position with a reputable company like John Lewis before, so I'm somewhat surprised by this. I bought a washing machine from John Lewis online, and it arrived last night. It was installed by the John Lewis men.

However, this morning I noticed when I put my first wash on that the soap drawer leaked water down the front of the machine during wash cycles.

I've owned a machine of this model before and it never behaved like this, so I know it's faulty. I called JL for a replacement or refund, but to my surprise they insisted on me calling Bosch & sending out an engineer to come and look at it in 8 days time. JL told me it's to establish "who is to blame".

I mentioned about the 14 day distance selling regs, and how I don't want the hassle of waiting 8 days for an engineer to come out, but JL insisted it was my only option. They refused to refund or replace without seeing the results from the Bosch engineer.

I explained this goes against the distance selling regs, but they wouldn't listen to me (in fact, many staff at JL were outrageously rude & one even refused to let me speak to a supervisor then hung up on me).

I was so shocked & appalled as this is John Lewis, not some disreputable online shop.

Has their customer service gone down hill in recent years, or am I wrong to expect a refund or replacement without an engineer visit? I've no idea what my next step is but I've already spent around 4 hours on the phone/on hold & really want to avoid any hassle as I'm in the middle of moving house & managing refurbishments.

I tried citizen's advice charity but couldn't get through to them, I guess they're quite busy.

pinkshoes

You are entitled to a full refund IF it is faulty, but the retailer is entitled to check it is faulty first before refunding.

So, if you get it returned and they find it is NOT faulty, you will the be liable for costs to have it returned to you.

I find their request reasonable but would expect a fixed time appointment or short time slot.

Fosterdog

John Lewis are correct, you are not cancelling under DSRs (which no longer exist) you are using your consumer rights and beer which JL are allowed to firstly verify that a fault exists and secondly that the fault is inherent and not down to user error or damage.

8 days is a bit on the long side for waiting for an engineer though.

bobwilson

so do my consumer rights state that I have to wait for a Bosch engineer to come out in 8 days? It's extremely inconvenient to have to plan ahead like this at the moment. I'd much rather just JL collect the machine & check the fault on their own time, not mine.

Another strange thing to note, was that the Bosch lady told me "you have 14 days cooling off period to cancel the engineer visit", which I'm not even paying for, quite bizarre. I tried to clarify this with her but she spoke in a very slow manner & didn't seem to make much sense.

waamo

They want to check you haven't taken a lump hammer to it in frustration or the such like.

As such you may look at the big dent you inflicted on it and decide to cancel the visit.

They are entitled to check this isn't the case.

bobwilson

waamo wrote: »

They want to check you haven't taken a lump hammer to it in frustration or the such like.

As such you may look at the big dent you inflicted on it and decide to cancel the visit.

They are entitled to check this isn't the case.

but if there was a big dent in it, they would have no way to prove I had dented it! It could have been like that upon delivery and not noticed until today. (not that there is a dent)

Anyway, I'm just quite shocked that this is the law, as making a customer wait 8 days for an engineer to see a brand new washing machine seems completely unreasonable- I'd have thought a reasonable law would state the shop must replace it or refund without forcing the customer to be visited by an engineer for a brand new device.

I don't suppose any of you have a link to the gov website / sentence that refers to this? I used to have a link in the olden days (10 years ago) but can't find it. I'm really surprised by all this.

waamo

This is hard work. They want to check for misuse of some description, not necessarily smacking it. It could be any kind of misuse that may not be immediately obvious which could include poor fitting by their own employees.

bobwilson

waamo wrote: »

This is hard work. They want to check for misuse of some description, not necessarily smacking it. It could be any kind of misuse that may not be immediately obvious which could include poor fitting by their own employees.

I'm aware of that but from what I know, the law usually gives benefit of the doubt to the consumer & often protects from companies wanting things that would be deemed too much hassle for the consumer (for example keeping packaging), and I'd have thought making a consumer arrange an engineer to come out would be considered unreasonable for a brand new device regardless of the justifications.

Could you show me the link to the gov website / sentence that you're getting your info from? I'm really surprised by all this.

boo_star

bobwilson wrote: »

I'm aware of that but from what I know, the law usually gives benefit of the doubt to the consumer & often protects from companies wanting things that would be deemed too much hassle for the consumer (for example keeping packaging), and I'd have thought making a consumer arrange an engineer to come out would be considered unreasonable for a brand new device regardless of the justifications.

It isn't entirely reasonable for you to have to arrange an engineer visit but sometimes doing as they say is the simplest and quickest way to get the resolution you want and digging your heels in is just going to make it take far longer than necessary.

This is probably one of those times.

bobwilson

boo_star wrote: »

It isn't entirely reasonable for you to have to arrange an engineer visit but sometimes doing as they say is the simplest and quickest way to get the resolution you want and digging your heels in is just going to make it take far longer than necessary.

This is probably one of those times.

it probably is, but I'd still like to know where the law stands on it

boo_star

bobwilson wrote: »

it probably is, but I'd still like to know where the law stands on it

The law says nothing about you calling up to arrange engineer visits.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2015/15/section/20/enacted is the relevant section of the law.