Parkingeye fine - Aire Street Leeds

Coupon-mad

Silvercloud18 wrote: »

Should i bother attempting to complain to POPLA about the assessor not sticking to the same guidelines as others?

Yes and about this being fatally wrong:

In terms of the technology of the ANPR cameras themselves, the British Parking Association audits the ANPR systems in use by parking operators in order to ensure that they are in good working order and that the data collected is accurate. Independent research has found that the technology is generally accurate.

See here:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/74260592#Comment_74260592

HTH

Silvercloud18

Thanks ill have a read.

And her whole summary paragraph is wrong as if she hasnt read any of my appeal or looked at evidence that i parked and paid elsewhere!?

"Fundamentally, it is the motorist responsibility to check for any terms and conditions, and either adhere to them or choose to leave. By parking your vehicle at the site, the driver of the vehicle is indicating an acceptance of the terms and conditions. After considering the evidence, I am satisfied that the appellant failed to meet these terms and conditions. I can only conclude the operator issued the parking charge correctly. Therefore, this appeal must be refused."

Silvercloud18

thank CM just read your reply on the decisions thread! I'm that annoyed about their lack of consistency i ended up ranting on the wrong thread. apologies.

Silvercloud18

Even started to get paranoid of a personal agenda as they're based 2 miles away from me :rotfl:

Going to do a letter of complaint under shortfall of service due to being so wrong about the anpr and massive inconsistencies in their service.

Will post when done

Silvercloud18

A complaint has been sent to POPLA. I'm not going to post details just yet as slightly paranoid over possible assessors lurking here.

I'll let you know if I get a reply. Not holding much hope out after the reports on my appeal:cool:

Silvercloud18

Received my reply about my complaint.... laughable at best although do admit that the assessor made a mistake saying ANPR is checked but then goes on to say they are humans!!!

Silvercloud18

Your complaint about POPLA

Thank you for your email dated 13 May, 2018 which was passed to me by the POPLA team as I am responsible for responding to complaints.

I note from your correspondence that you are unhappy with the decision reached by the assessor in your appeal against Parking Eye Ltd.

POPLA is an impartial and independent appeals service and we do not act either for the parking operator or the appellant. It is important to explain that it is not our remit to source evidence and documents from either party in support of their submission and our decisions are based on the evidence received from both parties at the time of the appeal. We cannot consider further evidence after the appeal has been completed.

You explained the conditions at this car park and stated this affected the driver leaving the site, the assessor responded to this as below "Section 13.2 of The BPA Code of Practice that states: "You should allow the driver a reasonable "grace period" in which to decide if they are going to stay or go. If the driver is on your land without permission, you should still allow them a grace period to read your signs and leave before you take enforcement action"
However, the driver remained at the car park for 15 minutes without making a payment. I have considered the size of this car park and based on that, I believe that 15 minutes is in excess of a reasonable period to remain in this car park without making a payment. While I appreciate the appellants comments about the car park conditions, I do not consider that it would take 15 minutes to park, attempt to read the signs then leave a car park of this size"

You asked if POPLA has a governing body; Ombudsman Services is the organisation which administers POPLA. The board is made up of independent directors. It is our boards role to appoint the Chief Ombudsman and to ensure the independence of the service.

You highlight that our assessor has incorrectly referenced that the BPA completes audits of Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) technology. The BPA Code of Practice (21.3) sets out that operators need to ensure the cameras are in good working order, that the data captured is accurate and securely held, and that the BPA's compliance team may audit the systems operators have in place.

Although the BPA Code of Practice sets out that it may audit the systems operators have in place; the BPA does not complete technical checks on the cameras. I am sorry for the misleading wording in the assessor's decision. We have provided advice to our team on this point today.

You have questioned how POPLA can receive two appeals with the same grounds of appeal and a different decision is made. While we accept that two appeals can outwardly appear to be based on the same information, decisions are very sensitive to the submissions of both parties.

The sequence of events presented by the motorist can take an appeal in different directions. As such, even if two motorists have the same parking circumstances, if one motorist provides more detail about the circumstances from the day, this may give our assessor much more information on which to base their decision.

In addition, we have humans applying judgement to the circumstances of each appeal. We provide decision-making guidance to our assessors and this is aimed at ensuring consistency. However, it is possible two assessors will weight evidence differently, and reach different outcomes. If the assessors have applied reasonable judgement to the facts, neither decision is necessarily wrong.

I appreciate the frustration this may cause but our service is a one-stage appeals service and our assessor must make the decision based on the information made available to them at the time.

Other points within your complaint remain unanswered as I consider that the assessor sufficiently considered each point given.

I have reviewed the assessor's decision and I am satisfied that the outcome reached is correct. As POPLA is a one-stage process, there is no opportunity for you to appeal the decision.

As our involvement in your appeal has now concluded you may wish to pursue matters further. For independent legal advice, please contact Citizens Advice at: www.citizensadvice.org.uk or call 0345 404 05 06 (English) or 0345 404 0505 (Welsh).

In closing, I am sorry that your experience of using our service has not been positive. We have reached the end of our process and my response now concludes our complaints procedure. I trust you will appreciate that there will be no further review of your complaint and it will not be appropriate for us to respond to any further correspondence on this matter.

Silvercloud18

Just to add my friends appeal was 2 pages long using my photographs mine was 9 including more photos. Just assume that was too long and she couldn't be bothered reading it in full.

Silvercloud18

So I guess I just wait for the court letter then? Honestly what are people's opinions on my chances? Feeling very frustrated with this whole ridiculousness from POPLA

Coupon-mad

Your chances are very good. And there is no risk, even if you lost at a hearing v PE you'd just pay £175ish and it will be over.

We consistently see 99% of well defended cases here, won, since 2017.

No risk, no CCJ, nothing bad. Just another bite at the dispute cherry and this time, a decision from (hopefully) a fairer and more consistent court.

I would indeed wait and see and fight it and use your friend's decision as evidence among your other evidence (photos, etc., and the ICO CoP on ANPR surveillance camera use 24/7 being potentially excessive and disproportionate).

Your friend could also be your witness, confirming that it's not just about the size of this car park, it's the surface rubble, lack of bays, lack of lighting, faded old machines that can't be read any better than the signs can, and the narrow shared entry/exit bottleneck that means even if you wanted to drive straight out, if 2 or 3 cars were manoeuvring or driving in blocking the exit, you could spend a few of extra minutes merely queuing and exiting alone.