Yet another PCN in a private car park space.

Klaggers

Ok- here goes. My intention was simply to be concise, not to give away any other details and to be reasonable.


Dear Sir/Madam,

Re: PCN Number: PMxxxxxxxx

Thank you for taking this time to read my appeal. On xx/xx/2018 at xx:xx the registered keeper of this vehicle was issued a PCN by Parking Control Management (UK) Ltd (PCM). PCM provided the following reason for issuing this notice:

'Parked without clearly displaying a valid PCM UK Ltd permit (at time of enforcement)'.

This PCN is being appealed as it is asserted that PCM did not provide sufficient evidence when issuing this PCN to demonstrate that their signage was compliant with Schedule 1 of the Independent Parking Committee Code of Practice. This includes:

'Identify the amount of any charge and explain when it becomes payable';

PCM are requesting that the registered keeper of this vehicle pays £100 as the 'vehicle was parked in a manner whereby the driver is liable to pay £100 as stated on the signage throughout the area'; as demonstrated in EVIDENCE A.jpg*; however the registered keeper has not been shown adequate evidence which clearly displays the fee(s) charged to any motorists who do not comply with the signage. This is due to the fact that the photographic evidence of the signage supplied by PCM, which was obtained when the PCN was issued, fails to include the charges incurred, and as a result the charges stipulated on PCN have no basis and are unable to be applied in this case.

'Identify yourself 'the Creditor'';

The evidence provided by PCM fails to adhere to the use of the required language; specifically PCM do not identify themselves as 'the Creditor'.

The evidence I am using to reinforce my position has been uploaded and titled EVIDENCE B.jpg**. In light of this, I am asserting that PCM are unable to impose any financial charge on the registered keeper for this alleged breach, as the costs outlined on the PCN have no basis. In addition to this, as PCM have not identified themselves as 'the Creditor' in the signage / evidence submitted by PCM, the registered keeper has no way of identifying that PCM are in fact responsible for this PCN.

I do thank you for taking the time to read this appeal.

Regards,

The registered keeper



* Evidence A = copy of the paper issued PCN stipulating why PCM are issuing this and how much they want
** Evidence B = the unedited picture PCM used as "evidence" when issuing the PCN.

Any input is really appreciated!

Klaggers

Quick bump.

DoaM

If that's the real PCN number please edit your post to mask it, as PPC stooges browse this board and that will identify you to them.

Can you link us to redacted copies of A and B please?

Klaggers

Hello all.

Sorry for the delay - I've just done a string of night work and I wasn't able to dedicate any real time to this.

DoaM wrote: »

If that's the real PCN number please edit your post to mask it, as PPC stooges browse this board and that will identify you to them.

Whoops! Done and done!

DoaM wrote: »

Can you link us to redacted copies of A and B please?

Evidence A - https://imgur.com/a/IoWdM
Evidence B - https://imgur.com/a/1KZBz

I am keen to get this submitted today - thank you all for your patience and support - I owe you all one. :beer:

Coupon-mad

Submit it then!

Klaggers

Hello everyone,

I have a quick question - although I am confident that I know the answer to this!

Does the signage which Private Parking Companies are obliged to display, specifically when placed on private land, have to be compliant with any current legislation? For instance, should a PPC state that their signage is complaint with relevant guidelines AND legislation, are they talking absolute twaddle? I am under the impression there is currently no legislation which stipulates the requirements of their signage; rather they get their "jurisdiction" from following the IPC Code of Practice?

Will update soon!

Klaggers

Coupon-mad

Does the signage which Private Parking Companies are obliged to display, specifically when placed on private land, have to be compliant with any current legislation?

Not as such especially for signage, but because the sign is an excuse for a 'contract' they could point to the Consumer Rights Act 2015 as legislation which does deal with t&cs in any consumer contract having to be clear and transparent, no hidden small print, etc.

Klaggers

Ah, never mind. I was hoping I could highlight the complete ignorance of the PPC in this instance. Best not point this out as it could backfire.

Thank you so much for the prompt response. This website/forum is amazing and I'm so grateful of the help so far. No updates at this moment, but hopefully will have news before long.

Klaggers

Klaggers

Hello all,

I thought I'd provide a brief courtesy update regarding my IAS appeal.

I think you all will be shocked and amazed that my appeal was rejected! :eek:

I fought it on the following points:

• The "evidence" submitted my PCM omits the details which stipulates the "charge", therefore cannot be reasonably be enforced as there is no "contractual" binding - https://imgur.com/a/IoWdM
• I parked in my own bay, and my tenancy agreement does not stipulate the mandatory use of a permit and previous court cases have set the precedent on this;
• Provided the details of the court cases which demonstrate PCM's inadequate signage resulted in the claims being dismissed;
• The fact that PCM have ticketed a legitimate resident of the estate which it is meant to be protecting from disruptive parking cannot be considered in the best interest of anyone apart from PCM, and this reckless and aggressive behaviour is the equivalent of extortion and has led to the proposed parliamentary interventions; and
• The permit was ACTUALLY on the dashboard, however PCM have opted to take a photograph which purposefully obscures this.

This was the long-and-short of it all and of course it was thrown out with some generic nonsense and my arguments were left primarily left unaddressed or, at best, vaguely mentioned and dismissed instantly.

I did inform Mrs. Klaggers that the likelihood of this appeal being accepted is minimal, and it is like urinating into the wind. However, here comes the kicker: she wants to pay the charge and just move on with her life, although no money has been parted yet. I have pleaded with her to just ignore this nonsense as the likelihood of this being pursued any further is not likely to go beyond some letters with some clever writing / format which seem more important and clever than they truly are. Furthermore, the chances of this progressing to a small claims is relatively small, and when they do, with help from the wonderful people who populate this forum, the success rate is approx 99%! I'm afraid she is not happy with this still as she has described the underlying anxiety behind it all, and that when every time an email / letter came through in regards to this issue, it really upset her, and had a marked impact on her for the rest of the day etc. As a result of this, this made me upset on her behalf, and would ruin my mood for the day. And to throw a spanner in the works, we are moving house in a few months, and she doesn't want to leave any loose ends and one less thing to worry about.
Anyway, I am even trying to make her contact PCM to pass over my details as the driver, and make me liable for this nonsense and I will simply ignore all further correspondence until necessary. She's not budging on this as she's saying this is her problem etc, and to pass them onto me is not acceptable.

Well, that's about it. I've rambled on long enough. Who knows, I may convince her to make me liable and I'll be back in a short while requesting help with an impending court date! Anyway, I owe you all one and thank you for the help you have provided me with getting this far.

Klaggers

nosferatu1001

Please get her to stay strong

If yuore moving house, then provide YOUR details as the new address for service maybe?