Britannia Driving School - Consumer Right Exist?

Lily_W

mollycat wrote: »

If intended for Lily I think thats a wee bit unfair

Sounds like she almost passed her first test, and rather than feeling a sense of injustice, resolved to rectify the deficit.

She has also demonstrated the insight into the fact there is ongoing learning following getting her licence and (to me) has come across as a sensible, responsible young lady. (assusmption alert ) There is no sense of entitlement here, just a motivation to "get it right".

Wow!

I very much appreciated that there is one person in this discussion, surprisingly from the ADI group, who understood my suffering.

Here there is another individual who understood me emotionally. The feeling - a sense of injustice.

Yes, I was not strong enough, became completely caught up with the issues with my driving instructor. Partly I struggled to believe that the care and the service I have received were real, when the consumer right is well known and well protected in the United Kingdom.

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Emotions and driving
Extremes of emotions – such as anger, sadness, stress, grief or even happiness – will affect your concentration and how you judge what’s happening on the road. Many crashes are caused each year by drivers being careless, thoughtless or reckless. If necessary, take some time to calm down and get into the right frame of mind before you get behind the wheel or ask someone else to drive.
A quote from website: safe driving for life.info
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If you are emotionally not fit to drive then do not drive. This is very true. On the testing day, a tiny also harmless request "can I please practice one more time?" (I also provided the reason), my instructor said "NO." With a great disbelieve I was disturbed and defeated. (Point number 4 in the original post. )

(Some people may be happy to hear this...)
On 31st January 2018, I made up my mind that I’m not going to pursue my driving project.
It has been more than a year, the energy, time and money that I have invested, it is not easy to drop. But I have to persuade myself ‘you cannot always win even though you are at the bright side, especially if they have the power to stop you’.

I’m posting my story here, wish to raise a concern about the learning condition of the learner drivers. It can be better, it should be better in a civilised world, and in a top country the Great Britain.

mollycat

Thanks for the feedback Lily, you are very welcome

Back to basics though young lady!

Bottom line is you want to learn to drive, so get back on the horse and do it

Focus your energies on finding that compatible instructor that will rebolster your confidence and take you that few extra % to help you get your licence; then kick on from there as a responsible driver gaining driving experience.

Do that instead of pursuing the feeling of unfairness and trying to resolve it....you are unlikely ever achieve a satisfactory outcome and the longer you pursue it the less helpful it is to you psychologically.

Im not accusing you of this, but the world is full of people burdened with grudge and unfairness, in many cases the insight of knowing to simply shrug it off is the thing that returns happiness. *

* Obviously not referring to human rights abuses etc

Lily_W

Car_54 wrote: »

The benefit is not in omitting the signal, it is in the habit of effective observation. Signalling "automatically" is a lazy habit which tends to lead to non-observation.

I see... If I tell you that I kept the good habit, the last small movement before turning left or right is to glance and check the blind spot, even if it's a bending turn on a continued road where the signal is certainly not required. You will not believe it could be my thing.

In fact, after I started learning drive, as a pedestrian walking on the pavement when I'm 'changing line' I started to check the 'blind spot' as well. Because I recognise the benefit, it's safer and useful, also helps me to build up good habit for driving.

I would like to know what your opinion is over this following training episode. Do you think I should do what my instructor has instructed? If I do I won't fail my test?

Lily_W wrote: »

...
The forward bay parking manoeuvre, we normally choose a bay where the neighbouring bays were empty. When I drove into the bay then packed the car, at that position he will ask me to turn the wheel (mean reverse and drive out the bay).

I said I could not do this, if I do I will fail my test. You have to straight reverse back about three quarters of the bay then turn into the direction you want. (In the real time if you are a full licensed driver you may choose to go across white lines when the neighbouring bays are empty, but the learner drivers are obliged to follow the correct procedural.)

Thanks.

Silvertabby

!!!8220; The benefit is not in omitting the signal, it is in the habit of effective observation. Signalling "automatically" is a lazy habit which tends to lead to non-observation.
Originally posted by Car 54

I'm with Lily on this one. Mr S tells me I indicate when I don't need to, but I do it because that is the way I was taught to drive in Germany - you indicate every turn, even if the road only curves (although I don't do that any more!).

It doesn't make me any less observant.

Manxman_in_exile

Silvertabby wrote: »

I'm with Lily on this one. Mr S tells me I indicate when I don't need to, but I do it because that is the way I was taught to drive in Germany - you indicate every turn, even if the road only curves (although I don't do that any more!).

It doesn't make me any less observant.[/QUOTE]


I agree. I think there is a logical fallacy here along the lines of " if you indicate automatically, you must not be observing correctly". I don't think that is necessarily true. More information must be better than less.


I live in a university town where student cyclists and pedestrians are invisible - they all dress in dark clothes and the cyclists don't use lights. I indicate at every junction and roundabout regardless of what I've observed because I don't know what I haven't seen - because they're invisible. I hope that by doing that I'm reducing the chances of killing someone.


There's also a roundabout near us which is really dangerous for pedestrians (and school kids use it too).
Lane 1 is either turn left or second exit. Drivers turning left don't bother to indicate because they think it doesn't matter. As a pedestrian it's a lottery. (It's bad for drivers too - I use it every day!).


I simply don't understand the POV that sometimes indicating is not necessary. In a perfect world where everybody drove exactly according to the rules that might be the case - but that's not where we are.


PS - just as I wouldn't want to kill someone where I had made the wrong decision whether to indicate or not - I wear a belt and braces to keep my trousers up. They haven't fallen down yet.

jimjames

Lily_W wrote: »

For those who questioned I couldn't drive or shouldn't drive, I think it is also a question towards to the DVSA examiner's judgement. My test results on 16th Jan was 4 faults + 1 dangerous fault, remember technically you're allowed to have 15 faults, but no serious or dangerous faults.

I'm sorry but it's one thing questioning the driving instructor. To then blame the DVSA examiner as well just indicates to me that you aren't ready to pass a test and won't accept anyone telling you how you should be driving properly.

Car_54

Lily_W wrote: »

I would like to know what your opinion is over this following training episode. Do you think I should do what my instructor has instructed? If I do I won't fail my test?

You said: "You have to straight reverse back about three quarters of the bay then turn into the direction you want. (In the real time if you are a full licensed driver you may choose to go across white lines when the neighbouring bays are empty, but the learner drivers are obliged to follow the correct procedural."

The examiners' guidance notes for this manoeuvre actually say "Candidates should park within a bay, but examiners should not be too concerned, when making their assessment, of the final position of the car in the bay. Parking outside the bay is unacceptable. Candidates should not normally be penalised for crossing the lines when entering the bay." (My emphasis).

Although it does not say so explicitly, it would seem illogical if the same did not apply when exiting the bay.

NBLondon

I didn't follow that at all the first couple of times it was posted.... (Bays weren't in the test in my day.) It sounds like the learner has driven into the bay and proved they can arrive within the marked area and is then expected to reverse out again. If it was a tight bay with vehicles on both sides then you would have to come out 3/4 of a car length before starting to turn the wheel. So it makes sense to me (as a layperson) that an instructor should make sure the learner can do that safely and under control - even if on the day of the test it's not so tight. Crossing the lines isn't automatically a fault if it's crossing into an empty bay - but if it's an occupied bay it might suggest the learner isn't fully in control.

Is both this and the indicate or not dilemma an example of "teaching to the test"? Is the learner doing it by rote, because they have memorised what a website tells them is the correct procedure to pass the test, or are they doing it the approved way because they understand why that's the approved way? We all know (including Lily) that there's lots more to learn once the test is passed - but there's more to learn before the test as well.

NBLondon

Lily_W wrote: »

On 31st January 2018, I made up my mind that I’m not going to pursue my driving project.

You don't need to give up. Maybe you need to step back and think about how you're approaching the project. You certainly need to find the instructor that's right for you (this has been said before) and work on building the trust between you. Tell them you had some problems last time and approach it with an open mind. Show them the list of faults (they may ask you to do that) and let them see what help you need to fix those. Then let them help. If you think they are wrong about something, ask why - if you just respond by telling them what's in the test you are not making them want to help you.

Do you want Britannia to do anything? Write them a clear and shorter letter explaining why you think they didn't give you the service you paid for - i.e. the instructor was poor and unhelpful. Give your examples but stick to the facts of what happened - don't cut and paste bits of websites. Say what you want them to do a) give you some money back or b) give you five free lessons with another instructor or c) something else. Get someone else to check it over - the way you write makes me think you are not a native English speaker.

Lily_W

NBLondon wrote: »

... Maybe you need to...

You are very warm-hearted, thank you! :A
I'm a Chinese-British, trying to learn the British Culture, Customs.

Never mind, I let it go.

As I've said the learner drivers's learning condition can be better, and should be better. (Think about the fair-trade.)
If there is no proper and effective review in place, some driving instructors can feel 'free to do what the hell they like' + 'my way or the high way' guess 'high' means expensive. both quoted from a hero :-) There is an incentive for some instructors to produce less than successful results, it is good for their business.

I've done my bits, to raise the awareness, cannot expect more.
Wish you all a good weekend ahead!!