Reclaiming a DD duplicate account payments

zenith23

We went through our DD/SOs on our bank account and have noticed two payments to our daughters karate club being made for her single membership for the last two years.

Both are for the same amount and processed via Harlands Group. I've no idea why the 2nd account was created and I can think of no reason then it being fraudulent.

Also the club changed hands last December a new debit set up but I received no instruction to close the original one down.

Can I use the indemnity scheme to fully reclaim the payments for the 2nd DD account and all the payments that have continue to be paid in for the 1st one this year?

I'm pretty certain the original club no longer exists so they can't explain it for receiving services or that we received additional services for the years we had both DD running.

cheers

agrinnall

Yes you can, because the DD Guarantee allows you to claim anything back and it must be given in full and immediately. Of course, if you actually did owe the money in the first place that would still be the case, and the originator could pursue you for it.

https://www.directdebit.co.uk/DirectDebitExplained/pages/howtoclaim.aspx

If there is an active DD that you don't think you should be paying I recommend that you cancel it yourself in your online banking, or by calling your bank, rather than relying on the originator to do it.

zenith23

agrinnall wrote: »

Yes you can, because the DD Guarantee allows you to claim anything back and it must be given in full and immediately. Of course, if you actually did owe the money in the first place that would still be the case, and the originator could pursue you for it.

https://www.directdebit.co.uk/DirectDebitExplained/pages/howtoclaim.aspx

If there is an active DD that you don't think you should be paying I recommend that you cancel it yourself in your online banking, or by calling your bank, rather than relying on the originator to do it.

Thank you replying

Well we owe for the first dd account as it does cover her club membership for those two years she attended the club before it was taken over/closed down.
As I see it we are due the full refund for the 2nd that shouldn't have been opened and the payments for the first that continue after the club wound down.
I am in contact with the company organising the DD for the original club they have said they're trying to contact the original owner but don't appear to be having much luck.
It appears my bank would get it back from them and they then claim from him?

soulsaver

zenith23 wrote: »

Both are for the same amount and processed via Harlands Group. I've no idea why the 2nd account was created and I can think of no reason then it being fraudulent.

cheers

A genuine mistake?

eddddy

zenith23 wrote: »

I'm pretty certain the original club no longer exists so they can't explain it for receiving services or that we received additional services for the years we had both DD running.

It's best not to descibe your claim in those terms to your bank - that sounds like a contractual dispute. The DD guarantee is expressly not for contractual disputes.

The DD guarantee relates to incorrect payments. e.g.
- They said they would take £10, but they took £100
- They said they would take the payment on the 20th, but they took it on the 10th
- They didn't give you 10 days notice of a change to the DD


So, for example, if the company said they were going to stop collecting payments against your first DD, but continued collecting them - that would probably be a valid claim.

slopemaster

I seem to remember theres a time limit for the DD guarantee tho I'm not sure what it is

zenith23

eddddy wrote: »

It's best not to descibe your claim in those terms to your bank - that sounds like a contractual dispute. The DD guarantee is expressly not for contractual disputes.

The DD guarantee relates to incorrect payments. e.g.
- They said they would take £10, but they took £100
- They said they would take the payment on the 20th, but they took it on the 10th
- They didn't give you 10 days notice of a change to the DD


So, for example, if the company said they were going to stop collecting payments against your first DD, but continued collecting them - that would probably be a valid claim.

except I've no reason to think why they asked us to open up another account. my wife opened the accounts but it's two years ago now and cannot remember why she would have two, we certainly don't need two accounts for one person.
However for what ever reason they did, they didn't ask us to close the first and haven't stopped it themselves.
even if it's a mistake on their part surely we've a valid claim because we didn't need two accounts for one person.
unfortunately no one can get hold of them for a response.
I want to push for indemnity against the processor of the DD, but first wish to know if it's valid.
The original club as far as I'm aware closed down last Dec/Feb time and the new one started, I certainly don't recall being told to stop the DD and would expect if the club is finished the account would be wound down and they should have stopped the DD as their no longer offering a service for it.

agrinnall

slopemaster wrote: »

I seem to remember theres a time limit for the DD guarantee tho I'm not sure what it is

This thread is pretty emphatic that there is no time limit.

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4091479

However, there is probably a limit to how far back the data is kept to allow a reclaim to be done, so anything more than 6 years could be problematic. Not an issue for the OP though.

eddddy

zenith23 wrote: »

except I've no reason to think why they asked us to open up another account. my wife opened the accounts but it's two years ago now and cannot remember why she would have two, we certainly don't need two accounts for one person.
However for what ever reason they did, they didn't ask us to close the first and haven't stopped it themselves.
even if it's a mistake on their part surely we've a valid claim because we didn't need two accounts for one person.
unfortunately no one can get hold of them for a response.
I want to push for indemnity against the processor of the DD, but first wish to know if it's valid.
The original club as far as I'm aware closed down last Dec/Feb time and the new one started, I certainly don't recall being told to stop the DD and would expect if the club is finished the account would be wound down and they should have stopped the DD as their no longer offering a service for it.

None of what you say there seems to make for a valid DD indemnity claim.

You might have a valid claim against the company, but not a valid DD indemnity claim.

For example,

zenith23 wrote: »

except I've no reason to think why they asked us to open up another account. my wife opened the accounts but it's two years ago now and cannot remember why she would have two, we certainly don't need two accounts for one person.

You're probably correct, you don't need two accounts for one person.

But if both DDs were collected correctly (even though they weren't needed, and even if the company misled to your wife), you have no basis for a DD indemnity claim.

Take a look here: https://www.directdebit.co.uk/DirectDebitExplained/Pages/DirectDebitGuarantee.aspx

zenith23

eddddy wrote: »

None of what you say there seems to make for a valid DD indemnity claim.

You might have a valid claim against the company, but not a valid DD indemnity claim.

For example,



You're probably correct, you don't need two accounts for one person.

But if both DDs were collected correctly (even though they weren't needed, and even if the company misled to your wife), you have no basis for a DD indemnity claim.

Take a look here: https://www.directdebit.co.uk/DirectDebitExplained/Pages/DirectDebitGuarantee.aspx

If that is the case and I cannot use the indemnity do you know how the funds can be reclaimed?

eddddy

zenith23 wrote: »

If that is the case and I cannot use the indemnity do you know how the funds can be reclaimed?

Your explanation of what happened is a bit unclear.

• If you took out 2 karate club memberships out for one person by mistake - it is simply your mistake, and you have no basis for claiming anything back.

• If the karate club misrepresented something (lied), or breached the contract, you can claim your money back from the karate club - through the small claims court, if necessary.

• From your description, it doesn't sound like any mistakes were made with the DD, so a DD indemnity claim isn't appropriate - but if you do convince your bank to make an indemnity claim, the karate club might take legal action against you to get the money back.

Did you get written contracts from the karate club? If so, you probably need to read them to find out how to cancel etc.