Ideal Boiler problem

RetiredButNotDeadYet

Hi
I wonder if I could have some advice on this situation.

In Jan 2014 a local GasSafe engineer installed a brand new Logic+24 boiler.

He told me it was 5 years warranty, and now to worry , he already registered the warranty with Ideal, and he gave me an 18 digit alphanumeric reference number for this.

The boiler, now 3.5 years old has started to lose pressure - . I Have done the suggested diagnostics, ie

1. Checked all the pipework and radiators for leaks, there definitely are none.
2. Pressure boiler up to 1.5 bar, turn off power, close boiler isolating valves. Pressure still drops.Boiler will go from 1.5 bar to zero over about 12 hours, and drops faster when boiler is off.

Tried to locate the original engineer,looks like he's retired and cleared off to Spain.

Rang Ideal. First thing they said was the boiler warranty wasnt registered with them. When pressured about the 18 digit g'tee reference number id got, they tried to say the engineer had registered it but i also had to activate it. I told them i was not told this and assumed that number was all that was required. They demanded £125 to 'activate; the G'tee, which I reluctantly paid becuse i want the boiler fixed. They wriggled a bit, They asked me if it had been serviced. It hasnt, but I pointed out serviced or not, its should last more than 3.5 years.

Ive googed the fault, the suggestion is its either the Pressure Relief Vale, the Expanions Tank or the Heater core. Either way, ist all covered in the 5 year g'tee (which again contradicts what we recall the engineer saying, he told us 7 years). They said faults caused by not having it serviced would be chargeable. I pointed out Sale of Goods Act, it must be merchantable quality, and by any measure a boiler should last more than 3.5 years. They indicated they were the sole arbiters of manufacturing fault.

However, they booked an engineer to call on 12th Dec, one week form now. so we'll see what happens,.

How do I stand here?

adonis

I think the main issue is that the boiler hasn't been serviced, all you can do is wait and see what happens when the engineer arrives.

Let us know what happens and make sure you have it serviced every year.

Peter999_2

My ideal boiler has a seven year guarantee, but it quite clearly said it has to be serviced every year for the guarantee to be honoured.

The guy who installed it for me comes every year and services it (not that there is much to service these days).

RetiredButNotDeadYet

Seems that the issue is "Would the fault have been prevented had the boiler been servced?" If its the worst case scenarior, the heater Core is leaking, then those who know in other places say this is a known issue with them ,and would not have been prevented by servicing. So are they not on dodgy ground if they refuse to repair under warranty on the basis of non-service, since the fault woudl not have been prevented by servicing?

So, planning ahead, if they are awkward, and demand large bags of money from me , would it be worth offering a compromise and saying ill pay for the parts if they fit them free, bearing in mind ive already given them £120, and I was unaware of the warranty conditions, having never seen or signed such a warranty (the engineer did it)

Alex1983

Ideal are terrible for warranty work, they will probably ask for the benchmark first, check the service details are filled in, do water sample and check it’s installed exactly to the manufacturer instructions.

From the 2nd test you’ve done you’ve proved it’s the boiler, tie a sandwich bag over the PRV pipe outside and see if it fills with water if it doesn’t it has to be the heat exchanger.

RetiredButNotDeadYet

which is the pvr pipe, there s 15mm copper pipe with domed end an slot, and a 5 inch flue thing. Its the smaller pipe ?

Alex1983

Yes the 15mm copper pipe.

RetiredButNotDeadYet

Interesting. I havent done the PVR pipe test, it looks dry though. Theres a third pipe, a 3/4" white plastic pipe that goes into the washing machine waste pipe. That couod be where the water is going. What does that pipe drain ?

More interestingly, i pressured it up at 20:00 last night, to 1.75 bar , its not lost any pressure at all since then. Its still 1.75 cold and about 1.9 running.

A pinhole in the heater core would not self heal, once its holed its holed, and stays holed until repaired. I wouldnt have thought such a fault could be intermittent, so maybe this is a badly behaving pressure release valve, which could easilty be intermittent

Alex1983

That’s the condense pipework, if the heat exchanger has failed that is where the water will go, down the condense pipe. I’d run it for a few days with the PRV bagged up and see what happens. You can remove the condense from the waste pipe and put it in to a bowl with the boiler off for a day or so and see if water goes into the bowl, this will prove the heat exchanger, YOU CANNOT RUN the boiler while you have the condense out of the waste pipe.

I’ve seen a heat exchanger leak internally before but intermittently at a certain temperature, it must expand and leak when hot.

RetiredButNotDeadYet

Seems that the hotter it is,the less it leaks. But then. like i said, off all last night, no pressure drop. Doesnt make sense. Ill set the the VR bag test up later today.

Somone is having a larf here , i think ... God taking the p**s....;)

RetiredButNotDeadYet

No water loss from PVR pipe, and no pressure loss for 36 hours. Surely this is looking like a misbehaving Pressure Release valve?