When did Free Speech disappear?

Cornucopia

Topcat123 wrote: »

It is a public space, who owns it is not relevant, if it is open to the public it should abide by public law not arbitrary justice.

Yes, I get that you think that, but it is not actually the case under our legal system, in these private spaces, now.

Should Jack the Ripper be allowed to dish out "justice"?

I've no idea what the relevance of that is.

No MP is being attacked, it is just words. They will not die if someone calls the a corrupt evil crook.

Yes, and no. History sadly shows that a proportion of threats of violence are pre-cursors to actual violence.

Legal action should not be possible the libel laws are wrong, their to protect the rich and powerful form criticism.

I don't think that's true, given that one major exemption to libel is that the comments made are true.

It seems you are not involved in the forums as a user but as one dishing out arbitrary punishment.

The words in my signature are absolutely true - BGs are not involved in forum disciplinary matters.

So of course you do not see the injustice as you are the one dishing it out. :rotfl:

I think we probably need to leave this here.

If you get a chance, have a look for discussions between me and posters like House Martin and Nessun Dorma. I think you'll see that significant patience is being exercised, and that I am putting even more distance than normal between me and any possible disciplinary action.

Muttleythefrog

Topcat123 wrote: »

Being denied the right to reply really bothers me, censorship enables genocide and was used by tyrants throughout history for that purpose,
nobody ever died from free speech.

Are you seriously suggesting MSE Andrea could be a tyrant capable of genocide. Sounds like a red card to me... it is after all the season for exchanging unwanted gifts...lol

Cornucopia

Muttleythefrog wrote: »

Are you seriously suggesting MSE Andrea could be a tyrant capable of genocide. Sounds like a red card to me... it is after all the season for exchanging unwanted gifts.

I think we should all be very relieved that an online forum isn't an ideal medium for ethnic cleansing.

(I can see these posts being removed. I really don't want to downplay the various tragic events dotted about our history, or denigrate their victims, but sometimes someone says something that you just have to react to...)

Cornucopia

Quizzical_Squirrel wrote: »

I don't think the younger generation are any more snowflakey than previous generations.

Students have always relished activism and exploring their newly found influence on the world.

I think part of it is that we have come through a period when young people were generally very apathetic about mainstream politics. That's now turned around, which is a good thing, but I think it has been something of a shock.

Because we live in a time of extraordinary peace in the west, the current generation have had to dig a bit deeper to actually find something to rally against.

Some of the concerns seem a little... trivial.

This, combined with the internet giving everyone a voice and a sense of self-importance has enabled collaborative effort to build entire edifices from shaky foundations.

I totally agree with this.

I truly don't believe the kids themselves are any different to previous generations but the difference is that they have been given a frightening amount of power through the internet.

I think kids have been getting more and more self-confident over the past few generations. In the past, the most self-confident kids were often those who had maturity and practical or academic skills to match.

Topcat123

Cornucopia wrote: »

It's tricky, isn't it: you want to create a community that people enjoy being part of, and yet you want to protect yourself (as owner/publisher) from legal action, and at the same time exercise a sense of public responsibility for taste and decency in what appears. I don't personally get any flavour of the kind of "injustice" you are talking about, but perhaps my expectations are different?

As someone involved in three very different forums, I think this sense of belonging is a fascinating thing - not least because we are talking primarily about short text messages being published anonymously online. The three forums (and my role in them) are all quite different in this respect, and I get a different perspective based on my roles here/there.

Justice is about equality, there is no need for the libel laws when we all have an equal right to speak.



Take the child abuse cases and other sexual abuse cases, does Mr Big's right to protect his "reputation" over ride a child's right to be protect from sexual abuse.

The law seems to think so.

And it is wrong.

[Deleted User]

I am probably very old fashioned (which I won't apologise for as I am an old woman) but to me the generation today that I see proclaimed as 'modern' seem to be awfully self obsessed with their own self importance and image. I was watching something on TV and the woman was banging on about how more or less if its on 'twitter or f/book then its almost writ in stone and believeable And people who get offended are right to be cross about it .

Well I'm sorry but if someone wrote on the 'social media ' platforms something I didn't like I would do the same as I do when something comes up on TV that I don't like I SWITCH IT OFF, not hard is it.

Sticks and stones etc I am all for freedom of speech and if I disagree with something or dislike it I find it just more simpler not to get my kecks in a twist about it.

I don't sweat the small stuff, but get angry about the serious stuff like children dying through lack of clean water or food.Or people living in this country sleeping in doorways or under by passes Thats stuff we should get angry about

Today apparently a women has complained on Twitter about getting a letter from her surgeon who had treated her small daughter She had been unable to take the child to see him as she was unwell so her husband did.The Doctor apparently said in the letter how her OH had 'manfully' brought the child instead of Mum to see him

This daft woman got in a strop and said how appalled and disgusted she was by receiving such a 'sexist 'letter Never mind that the Dr had helped to make her child well again t no cost to herself but no thank you Dr for helping just a whinging twitter about some letter that had offended her
The world has definitely gone raving mad

All this gender neutral codswallop about children is turning our children into self obsessed over protected little darlings I think the next generation will grow up totally confused as to what they are supposed to be Apparently it will be Men Women and Zee as the three 'sexes ' in future

God help us all Or should that be 'The fairy in the sky' help us all to keep every one happy

Cornucopia

Topcat123 wrote: »

Justice is about equality, there is no need for the libel laws when we all have an equal right to speak.

I don't see the relationship between the two (in fact having an absolute right to speak seems like it would generate more libel, not less).

Take the child abuse cases and other sexual abuse cases, does Mr Big's right to protect his "reputation" over ride a child's right to be protect from sexual abuse.

The law seems to think so.

And it is wrong.

Yes, you're right, it IS wrong. It's also not happened, AFAICS.

Don't confuse the lack of a published name in the media with inaction on the offence itself - they are two completely different things.

Topcat123

Muttleythefrog wrote: »

Are you seriously suggesting MSE Andrea could be a tyrant capable of genocide. Sounds like a red card to me... it is after all the season for exchanging unwanted gifts...lol

When people have absolute power it is a natural progression.

"I don't have time to sort out these problem, I am too busy write my next
moral boosting speech to the masses, so send them to the Gulag".

And we can see it happening here, a prime example, your sycophantic groveling to Andrea. :rotfl:

Eventually that sort of stuff goes to one's head.

This is what happens, delusions of grandeur are created and reinforced, before you know it you are worshiping Andrea like a deity!

It is a very dangerous thing as it becomes self reinforcing.

Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao Zedung....

Soon you will have a picture of Andrea in your bedroom! :rotfl:

And of course we see it with Facebook and Twitter trying to influence elections.

We know Milo was banned from Twitter for nothing.

An absolutely disgusting thing to do by a corrupt platform.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Pds9ytbPsU

Note the feminist there asking him questions but the censors him by talking over his excellent answers - disgusting abuse of power.

pepper77_2

Topcat123 wrote: »

When people have absolute power it is a natural progression.

"I don't have time to sort out these problem, I am too busy write my next
moral boosting speech to the masses, so send them to the Gulag".

And we can see it happening here, a prime example, your sycophantic groveling to Andrea. :rotfl:

Eventually that sort of stuff goes to one's head.

This is what happens, delusions of grandeur are created and reinforced, before you know it you are worshiping Andrea like a deity!

It is a very dangerous thing as it becomes self reinforcing.

Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao Zedung....

Soon you will have a picture of Andrea in your bedroom! :rotfl:

And of course we see it with Facebook and Twitter trying to influence elections.

We know Milo was banned from Twitter for nothing.

An absolutely disgusting thing to do by a corrupt platform.

Seriously ? You dont all ready have one?

andrewf75

Topcat123 wrote: »

When people have absolute power it is a natural progression.

They don't have "absolute power" though, just the power to decide what is said on their website.
If you allow free speech on a website, say goodbye to sensible debate
I have no idea what people get banned for on here, but its nothing to do with me. It seems like a well run site so I trust them to make judgments.