MSE News: Ebico offers 'free' electricity at night for Economy 7

footyguy

NittyGritty wrote: »

figures come from "cheap energy club"


yes I could get the deal as I,m all electric, but the 60% maximum and smart meter as pretty much put me off, as I use more than 60% night time rate at times


Illustrative electricity cost on this tariff Based on the usage figures you gave us, this is the estimated cost you'll pay for the next year. Based on your usage Assumed annual consumption 12500 kWh Estimated annual cost £713

the annual figure above is if I take ebico deal)

the figure below is my current deal with Bulb


Your Electricity Tariff: Vari-Fair
Current cost £1,145/year
£95/month

Have you perhaps changed the default method of calkculation the CEC uses? i.e based on current tariff costs rather than the Ofgem mandated calculation method based on the next 12 months cost?

Because using simultaneous equations and the figures you provide, the only way the costs could be correct is if you assumed (+/- 1 or 2 ish):
3131 kWh - normal rate
10161 kWh - low rate

But that obviously is a total of 13292kWh, not 12500kWh the image indicates you assumed per annum.

Aceshigh84

The terms and conditions for this tariff are not at all crystal clear and very much open for interpretation.

"2.3. Whilst on this Tariff, you should not consume more than 60% of your electricity during the night period. If you exceed this reasonable usage threshold, we may contact you in accordance with clause 3.6."

"Should not" is not mandatory and clause 3.6 refers to paying by direct debit. Also, is this 60% figure calculated daily, weekly, monthly or yearly?

"3.1. This Tariff is only available to customers who have (or agree to have) a Smart Meter operating in credit mode, or an Economy 7 Credit Meter. "

So you can have it without a smart meter.

"3.2. If you do not currently have a Smart Meter installed at your Property, you must agree to an appointment for us to install a Smart Meter free of charge. We will contact you to arrange an installation date. The installation date must occur within a reasonable time after your
supply start date."

Ok, so now you have to simply agree to have a smart meter fitted...

"3.3. If you miss the appointment, or we are not informed at least two working days’ prior to the installation date that you wish to cancel or re-arrange the appointment, you will be required to pay a £75 missed appointment charge. You must ensure that we are able to access the existing meter at your Property on the installation date. If we are unable to install a Smart Meter for technical reasons, this will not affect your Tariff."

... And then cancel the appointment to keep the existing standard economy 7 meter...

3.4. Whilst you do not have a Smart Meter installed at the Property, you agree to provide Ebico with monthly meter readings"

Again, so you don't *need* a smart meter.

jk0

Ah, sadly, I think this is a 'sprat to catch a mackerel'. I'm sure they can't really give away free overnight energy, hence the 60% limit. It's just to encourage you to take a smart meter, which presumably the government rewards them for. I doubt this offer will be available in a year's time.

EachPenny

Aceshigh84 wrote: »

"Should not" is not mandatory and clause 3.6 refers to paying by direct debit. Also, is this 60% figure calculated daily, weekly, monthly or yearly?
....
3.4. Whilst you do not have a Smart Meter installed at the Property, you agree to provide Ebico with monthly meter readings"

Again, so you don't *need* a smart meter.

Putting 2 and 2 together, in the absence of being able to find a definitive answer I'd speculate that the 60% threshold is checked on a monthly basis (but not necessarily acted upon).

That would explain the compulsion of providing monthly readings, with Ebico preferring smart metering to avoid the consumer being 'economical' in the way they manually report readings during periods of high night consumption with the intention of catching up to the actual meter readings during the lower Summer months. Not that anybody would be so naughty of course

EachPenny

jk0 wrote: »

Ah, sadly, I think this is a 'sprat to catch a mackerel'. I'm sure they can't really give away free overnight energy, hence the 60% limit. It's just to encourage you to take a smart meter, which presumably the government rewards them for. I doubt this offer will be available in a year's time.

But they aren't really giving it away free.

If you compare the prices to their zero tariff then as footyguy notes in post #4 the high standing charge 'pays' for about 6 units per night. Although people will use a lot more than that in the Winter, not many would use more than about 2 night units in the Summer. So you get some 'free' electricity in Winter, but give them some back (as the units you don't use) in the Summer.

The 60% cap, if applied monthly or more frequent, prevents the customer getting too much for free when they need it.

robin58

Having read some of the replies here it seems to be very 'smoke and mirrors' to me.

Says a lot that some of you who have worked it out are still confused.

NittyGritty

footyguy wrote: »

Have you perhaps changed the default method of calkculation the CEC uses? i.e based on current tariff costs rather than the Ofgem mandated calculation method based on the next 12 months cost?

Because using simultaneous equations and the figures you provide, the only way the costs could be correct is if you assumed (+/- 1 or 2 ish):
3131 kWh - normal rate
10161 kWh - low rate

But that obviously is a total of 13292kWh, not 12500kWh the image indicates you assumed per annum.

as far as i can see there is only 1 default on cheap energy you enter your kwh etc, and you get a quote the only options after that are to "show full market comparison or mse top picks, i have show full market,




the other options on the left are monthly direct debit, all tarriffs price including/excluding cashback etc


update: just done the exact same figures (12500kwh a year) on confused.com and they come back with exact same figures as cheap energy, so i,m not sure what default option your refuring too

Frozen_up_north

robin58 wrote: »

Having read some of the replies here it seems to be very 'smoke and mirrors' to me.

Says a lot that some of you who have worked it out are still confused.

Ebico are themselves confused... I am an E7 user and entered my usage, 5736 KW night and 548 KW day. They offered their Night Owl deal at £23 per month, despite their "60%" limit (I entered 90% night use).

If it looks too good to be true... I didn't phone them to ask how it was possible to offer such a low price deal when clearly their on-line "quote" isn't going to work.

footyguy

NittyGritty wrote: »

as far as i can see there is only 1 default on cheap energy you enter your kwh etc, and you get a quote the only options after that are to "show full market comparison or mse top picks, i have show full market,




the other options on the left are monthly direct debit, all tarriffs price including/excluding cashback etc


update: just done the exact same figures (12500kwh a year) on confused.com and they come back with exact same figures as cheap energy, so i,m not sure what default option your refuring too

When you look at your comparison on the CEC, at the top where it details your current supplier and tariff, on the LHS is is headed "WHAT YOU'RE CURRENTLY PAYING"

On the RHS is is headed: "WHAT YOU'LL PAY AFTER YOUR FIXES END"

At the bottom of that top section, on the LHS it says "
All savings are based on this cost" and by default their should also be a tick to the right

On the RHS, it says: "Base your savings on this cost instead " and by default, there should be no tick.

Make sure you have not changed the default settings by accident; as you get the same results from Confused.com, then I suspect you have.

footyguy

Frozen_up_north wrote: »

Ebico are themselves confused... I am an E7 user and entered my usage, 5736 KW night and 548 KW day. They offered their Night Owl deal at £23 per month, despite their "60%" limit (I entered 90% night use).

If it looks too good to be true... I didn't phone them to ask how it was possible to offer such a low price deal when clearly their on-line "quote" isn't going to work.

No confusion by Ebico.
Ebico do a simple calculation based on the information you provide
GIGO.
It's up to you to abide by their terms. Ebico do not say they will automatically prevent you having the tariff if you fail to abide by the terms, but they may bump you off it if you breach the terms you agree to abide by.