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bitcoin trading.
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Supernet are well established and have been around for several years.
Their platform is at the cutting edge with decentralised & trustless exchanges using atomic swaps, decentralised ICO tech, decentralised gaming, multi coin wallet, in wallet coin mixer and a transaction limit that exceeds visa.0 -
The whole crypto mainly used by criminals is nonsense.
Fiat currency including the pound and dollar has and always will have a greater link to crime than any crypto. Perhaps governments should clean up their own house including the banks before diverting attention to crypto currency.
Can you provide any evidence to support this assertion?Total crytpo currency market cap currently stands at around $372 billion.
Are you seriously suggesting that is mostly down to criminal activity?
The estimated annual value of the global drugs trade is around $435 billion (UNODC, 2013). The estiated annual value of pirated goods is around $461 billion (OECD, 2016). The cost of global tax evasion stands at around $3.1 trillion annually (World Bank, 2011).
It is not beyond the realms of possibility (nor, arguably, probability), that a very large proportion of crypto currency transactions are from the back economy.My statement regarding Fiat and banks links to criminal activity is factually accurate, for example HSBC laundering money for drug cartels.
HSBC were not, as far as law enforcement agencies were concerned, money laundering for drug cartels. Rather, their practices and systems were not fit for purpose in identifying, reporting and preventing money laundering. It is an important distinction.
Furthermore, nobody has suggested that fiat currencies aren't used in illegal activity, but rather that crypto currency has proven very useful to criminals. Again, this is an important distinction.0 -
ValiantSon wrote: »Can you provide any evidence to support this assertion?
The estimated annual value of the global drugs trade is around $435 billion (UNODC, 2013). The estiated annual value of pirated goods is around $461 billion (OECD, 2016). The cost of global tax evasion stands at around $3.1 trillion annually (World Bank, 2011).
It is not beyond the realms of possibility (nor, arguably, probability), that a very large proportion of crypto currency transactions are from the back economy.
HSBC were not, as far as law enforcement agencies were concerned, money laundering for drug cartels. Rather, their practices and systems were not fit for purpose in identifying, reporting and preventing money laundering. It is an important distinction.
Furthermore, nobody has suggested that fiat currencies aren't used in illegal activity, but rather that crypto currency has proven very useful to criminals. Again, this is an important distinction.
Your second point provides the evidence you asked for in your first point.0 -
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ValiantSon wrote: »???
No it doesn't.
Perhaps you would like to explain yourself, or instead stop making unsubstantiated assertions.
I stated that fiat currency has a stronger link to crime than crypto does. The figures you posted in your second point proves this to be true as the total cost of crime exceeds the total market cap of crypto by a large margin therefore must be linked to Fiat.
Assertion substantiated
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I stated that fiat currency has a stronger link to crime than crypto does. The figures you posted in your second point proves this to be true as the total cost of crime exceeds the total market cap of crypto by a large margin therefore must be linked to Fiat.
Assertion substantiated
No it isn't. The total value of fiat currencies far exceeds the total value of crypto currencies. It is, therefore, entirely to be expected that criminal transactions will occur in fiat currencies too. As a proportion of the total value of those currencies, the proportion in fiat currencies could well be significantly less than the proportion in crypto currencies. This does not prove that, "fiat currency has a stronger link to crime than crypto does." This is a specious argument.
For your illumination:- a study by the University of Sydney and the University of Technology Sydney, found that 44 per cent of bitcoin transactions were associated with illegal activity;
- Europol recently issued a report stating that 4% of all criminal proceeds in Europe are now funnelled through crypto currencies, amounting to $5.5 billion (and the trend is increasing);
- a recent academic paper concluded that, "There is little doubt that by providing a digital and anonymous payment mechanism, cryptocurrencies such as bitcoin have facilitated the growth of 'darknet' online marketplaces in which illegal goods and services are traded.";
- the same paper continued, "We find that illegal activity accounts for a substantial proportion of the users and trading activity in bitcoin.";
- they continued, "The estimated 24 million bitcoin market participants that use bitcoin primarily for illegal purposes (as at April 2017) annually conduct around 36 million transactions, with a value of around $72 billion, and collectively hold around $8 billion worth of bitcoin.";
- and, "Our paper also contributes to understanding the intrinsic value of bitcoin, highlighting that a significant component of its value as a payment system derives from its use in facilitating illegal trade. "
Furthermore, what you actually wrote was,Fiat currency including the pound and dollar has and always will have a greater link to crime than any crypto.
You have in no way provided any substantiation for this assertion.
You then went on to write,Total crytpo currency market cap currently stands at around $372 billion.
Are you seriously suggesting that is mostly down to criminal activity?
The figures I then provided demonstrated that it was perfectly feasible for all of your stated $372 billion to come from criminal activity. (I did not say that it did, but rather presented the evidence to counter your flawed assertions).
You have made unsubstantiated assertions and drawn flawed conclusions. I suggest that you should quit now and learn a little bit more about the nature of proof, how to draw conclusions from evidence, and the construction of a logical argument.0 -
Crypto has only existed for about 6 years.
How much has financial crime increased since its creation since you seem to an expert in this area?
Perhaps your just buying into the negative propaganda created by financial institutes and governments that fear what they cant control and threatens their hold over people.
Going back to previous point.
Banks caught laundering money for Russians:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/mar/20/british-banks-handled-vast-sums-of-laundered-russian-money
Banks laundering money for drug cartels:
http://money.cnn.com/2018/02/08/news/rabobank-mexico-drug-money-laundering/index.html
Then we the libor scandal, precious metals manipulation it goes on an on and these are just the ones we know about.
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/jan/18/libor-scandal-the-bankers-who-fixed-the-worlds-most-important-number
http://heartlandpreciousmetals.com/deutsche-bank-admits-it-rigged-gold-prices-agrees-to-expose-other-manipulators/
The biggest financial crooks in the world = whole banking system and they don't deal in crypto0 -
Crypto has only existed for about 6 years.
How much has financial crime increased since its creation since you seem to an expert in this area?
Strawman.Perhaps your just buying into the negative propaganda created by financial institutes and governments that fear what they cant control and threatens their hold over people.
Would you like to borrow a tinfoil hat?Going back to previous point.
By that you mean failing to engage with what I've written and side-stepping it. Classic response of someone who can't back up what they say.Banks caught laundering money for Russians:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/mar/20/british-banks-handled-vast-sums-of-laundered-russian-money
An out of date report, but nonetheless it doesn't prove that the banks are complicit. Furthermore, I have never said that banks have not been involved in money laundering, but rather rejected the false assertion that HSBC had been proven to have done so.
What has this to do with whether or not crypto currency use is significantly dependent upon the black economy?Banks laundering money for drug cartels:
http://money.cnn.com/2018/02/08/news/rabobank-mexico-drug-money-laundering/index.html
Again, I have never said that banks were not involved in money laundering.
What has this to do with whether or not crypto currency use is significantly dependent upon the black economy?Then we the libor scandal, precious metals manipulation it goes on an on and these are just the ones we know about.
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/jan/18/libor-scandal-the-bankers-who-fixed-the-worlds-most-important-number
And what is your point in relation to the issue at hand, which is the use of crypto currencies as significantly being dependent on the black economy?
http://heartlandpreciousmetals.com/deutsche-bank-admits-it-rigged-gold-prices-agrees-to-expose-other-manipulators/
The biggest financial crooks in the world = whole banking system.[/QUOTE]
What has this to do with whether or not crypto currency use is significantly dependent upon the black economy?
Another trait of those who cannot sustain an argument is to switch tactics and try and throw in superficially related, but ultimately irrelevant, nuggets of information. Please see your list above for an example of this kind of argument.0 -
Why do you think bitcoin is more favorable to criminals than cash.
Cash is anonymous, bitcoin is not.0 -
Why do you think bitcoin is more favorable to criminals than cash.
Cash is anonymous, bitcoin is not.
Have you ever tried running a significant criminal enterprise that is based solely in cash? It would be an absolute nightmare.
Crypto currencies are effectively anonymous, or at least they have the potential to be.0
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