Brexit, the economy and house prices part 5

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

Rinoa wrote: »

The Conservative Manifesto is very explicit.

We will leave the single market, leave the customs union and no longer be subject to ECJ rulings.

And that manifesto went out the window when it cost the Conservatives their majority.

Minority governments have to compromise.

Mogg and Co can shout all they like but they don't have the votes in parliament nor the backing of a majority of voters.

Enterprise_1701C

gfplux wrote: »

Just in time for the holidays. The Euro buys a few more pounds since the beginning of June. A Brexit dividend for the European tourist visiting Britain.

And a dividend for us, they will come over here and splash the cash

Herzlos

Very true; it might encourage them to spend more £ when over here.

But it also means we'll have to spend more £ when holidaying abroad.

Rinoa

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

And that manifesto went out the window when it cost the Conservatives their majority.

Minority governments have to compromise.

Mogg and Co can shout all they like but they don't have the votes in parliament nor the backing of a majority of voters.

From Theresa May's Mansion House speech 2nd March 2018, a long time after the 2017 election:
https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/pm-speech-on-our-future-economic-partnership-with-the-european-union

We are leaving the single market.

The UK has been clear it is leaving the Customs Union.

But, in the future, the EU treaties and hence EU law will no longer apply in the UK. The agreement we reach must therefore respect the sovereignty of both the UK and the EU!!!8217;s legal orders. That means the jurisdiction of the ECJ in the UK must end.

JRM simply wants her to carry out these pledges.

Zero_Gravitas

Rinoa wrote: »

From Theresa May's Mansion House speech 2nd March 2018, a long time after the 2017 election:
https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/pm-speech-on-our-future-economic-partnership-with-the-european-union

JRM simply wants her to carry out these pledges.

I’m sure he does. But let’s be under absolutely no illusion that he wants her to carry out the pledges for any reason other that he thinks they will be good for Jacob Rees-Mogg.

System

I think the majority of the country has reached the point where they wished JRM would shut his caviar-hole for 10 minutes while the grown ups get on with it.

This little quote perfectly sums this pointless exercise up for me:

"Leave or remain or not bothered, I don't think Brexit is about voters anymore. The government are blatantly, in plain sight, searching exclusively for a form of words or deal that does not fracture the Conservative Party. Or at least that's my feeling. Does anybody disagree?"

What's best for the country or the people in it hasn't mattered for a long time.

buglawton

JRM lengthy piece in The Sun yesterday
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/6680959/ignore-false-alarms-we-are-seizing-our-chance-to-be-free-and-taking-control-of-our-future/
(might just fly over heads of most Sun readers)

kabayiri

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

And that manifesto went out the window when it cost the Conservatives their majority.

Minority governments have to compromise.

Mogg and Co can shout all they like but they don't have the votes in parliament nor the backing of a majority of voters.

Without taking sides, the GE was pretty flawed wasn't it?

I argued at the time that it should be a single issue election...Brexit, but plenty of people disagreed with me (not unusual :rotfl:)

So when you have a compromise government, what was the compromise manifesto?

As far as I can see, both Labour and Tory stood on Leave agendas - with little conviction, and only the LibDems were honest in their preference towards staying in.

phillw

kabayiri wrote: »

It's not just Tories. Apparently, Unite now support a second referendum, but nobody seems clear on what the question will be.[/QUOTE[

It would have to be a vote about what we want to happen, rather than the previous referendum which was a license for Reese Mogg to do his worst.

Was it only the LibDems who were honest during the GE?, and look what happened to their share of the vote.

The whole "both sides lied" argument is poor. David Cameron never said that brexit would trigger world war 3 no matter how many people claimed he did (and the daily mail are still claiming that).

He pointed out that europe has never in it's history been so stable and that is all because of the EU, so dismantling it for tenuous reasons is kinda reckless. Both the two world wars were due to economic problems which the EU was set up to prevent (which was at our recommendation and then when our economy suffered we begged to join too).

kabayiri wrote: »

Without taking sides, the GE was pretty flawed wasn't it?

GE generally are. You have 5 different groups fighting for their chance to govern, the largest wins. The Largest might only be 21% of the population in that area, dictating to the other 79% what they should do. I have always voted conservative, but I would have liked a "I don't care, but just not conservative" vote. The parties that do well from ffp voting always say it's the fairest, but they would. It stinks as a mechanism.

The EU was a perfect system, because no matter who we stupidly voted for because of ingrained prejudices and being seduced by liars with good pr teams, we didn't have the power to inflict any self harm. Now because of voter apathy during the first referendum because everyone thought we'd stay in, we're going to have to figure out either how to fix the problems with democracy in the UK or abandon the country for one that isn't so cray cray. The "you snoozed you lose" argument is pretty galling.

kabayiri

buglawton wrote: »

JRM lengthy piece in The Sun yesterday
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/6680959/ignore-false-alarms-we-are-seizing-our-chance-to-be-free-and-taking-control-of-our-future/
(might just fly over heads of most Sun readers)

He's right about the Irish bluff isn't he? Managing an effective border is an implementation problem between Eire and UK. Over time we will get it right. We'd have had the same potential challenge with an independent Scotland, yet nobody was fretting over it.