Parking charge - permit on show but not in bay

System

Third case: yes, absolutely, do both. Explain that the claim arises from identical circumstances and therefore cannot succeed and invite the court to strike it out and the Claimant to discontinue it. Tell C you will agree to a discontinuance on a costs neutral basis (ie you will not seek costs) but if they continue and you have to defend it you will rely on today's outcome to seek Rule 27.14(2)(g) costs.

Res Judicata applies: "a matter that has been adjudicated by a competent court and therefore may not be pursued further by the same parties"

Gladstones would need to show the basis on which RJ did not apply or suffer the costs but bare in mind that they are likely to continue as that is their method. You just have to push back.

Ralph-y

Really well done .... :j

would you consider taking a few mins to support this campaign ....

(you may wish to wait the outcome of the third case if its not to far away)

Call for Action - submit evidence of private parking rip-offs Which? Magazine now! WHICH are asking again for consumer problems

https://whichcouk.bsd.net/page/s/which-taking-on-2018

Which are pretty good at hitting the government with
consumer problems.
No harm in them hearing from you, I have done it for
the great parking scam and their dodgly solicitors

Only takes a couple of mins



thanks


Ralph:cool:

The_Deep

Tell C you will agree to a discontinuance on a costs neutral basis (ie you will not seek costs)

No no no no no, give them an inch and they will take a yard. These people need to be put through the mangle, stiff them for every last penny.

Coupon-mad

Laura_Higgs_76 wrote: »

I WON!!
I got awarded £91.

Course you did, never in doubt! WELL DONE for keeping the faith, another win! :T

Loadsofchildren123

Some light reading for you.


Under CPR rule 3.4(2)(b) any further claim relating to the same issue should be struck out as an abuse of process


http://www.lawmentor.co.uk/glossary/R/res-judicata/


https://www.barkerbrettell.co.uk/common-sense-prevails-over-common-law-in-the-english-courts/


https://www.charlesrussellspeechlys.com/en/news-and-insights/insights/litigation--dispute-resolution/2014/to-re-litigate-or-not-to-re-litigate-that-is-the-question/


I think both "cause of action estoppel" and "issue estoppel" apply to you, so you'd argue them in the alternative (start with coae and then say if that doesn't apply then ie does).


So you need to write them a stiff letter telling them that under the legal principle res judicata the issue has already been adjudicated upon, that both cause of action estoppel and issue estoppel apply to the new claim and they cannot pursue it. If they attempt to, the new claim then you will apply for an immediate strike out under Rule 3.4. Tell them that they must discontinue, or you will apply for an immediate strikeout and will seek full indemnity costs, including the costs of applying for a transcript of the judgment of x date.
If you have incurred any costs so far in relation to this ticket/these proceedings? If so you could itemise them and ask them to pay you £x, or you could offer drop hands. Also point out that if they pursue this claim then you will apply for rule 27.14(2)(g) costs as their conduct is clearly unreasonable and the claim should never have been brought (separately or at all) and should have been discontinued immediately upon the judgment of the other claim.


If you have to issue an application you will have to do it on Form N244 and you will have to supply evidence (this is required to be in a witness statement, but the statement can really just repeat what's in the letter, and explain all about the first proceedings). Remember to ask for costs on the N244. There is a fee to pay: £255 if you want a hearing, £100 if you ask for it to be dealt with on paper. With your statement you should provide the transcript. The transcript will take some time because a transcript of a judgment has to be sent to the judge for approval, so it can take a month or more. So you need to tell them that they have 7 days to reply to your letter or you will apply for the transcript and you will seek to recover those costs from them in the event of a later discontinuance, or the claim being denied. I think you could reasonably expect the court to deal with this on paper so therefore pay the £100 fee. You'll get that back if you win, they will make a costs order in your favour. Remember though that you MUST seek costs in the application form itself.

Laura_Higgs_76

nosferatu1001 wrote: »

Transcripts you have to pay for. For just the judgement its about £50, you have o go through the court to do this.

Cheque most likely

I would write to the claimant and state that as they have vexatiously listed THREE claims of which you managed to get 2 together, and you won, you suggest they immediatley discontinue the final case else yo uwill look to claim full costs under CPR27.14(2)(g) (go read and research this)

and well done! Which firm was the rep from?

So I may have done this part wrong - I did as you said and asked who he worked for - but even the Usher recognised him! And he had 2 cases and is in there everyday so I assumed he had rights of audience so when I asked him, he just brushed over it! Sorry - knew this was wrong of me but I didn't understand it enough to even do anything with his answer. To be honest - he was the reason I won the case, was better with him in there as he didn't even know what evidence he had (because he didn't bring it with him) so he told the judge he had none and that's how it got dismissed.

Laura_Higgs_76

The_Deep wrote: »

I got awarded £91.

Peanuts, I am disgusted

I didn't even get to say anything!!!

Why not, you were lied to, bullied, threatened, your leasehold tights were compromised, and you did not say anything. Is there any wonder that PPCs profitably infest blocks of flats? Have you considered taking revenge?

I would now follow The Count's advice, and/or send the PPC an invoice for your time at £19 an hour, which they will ignore. Next, send them a letter before claim, joining in the MA, there are plenty of free example on the internet.

Then, if they ignore it it is up to you, personally, I would issue a claim, but be under no illusion, you have won nothing - yet.

At the end I got to list their unreasonable behavious and I made about 8 points - which I included in my cost schedule (thanks to advice!!). But the claimant piped up and said "i think there is a limit of £90" so the judge awarded me £91 haha.

Can I invoice them for my time even though it wasn't awarded at court?

I don't think I have the nerve to be in court again :-) Not sure what leg I would have to stand on either

Laura_Higgs_76

Loadsofchildren123 wrote: »

Fantastic news, well done for putting in the work.


Transcript: no, you have to request (and pay for) this. Did it say anything useful (in which case you might consider donating your £96 to the cause, and of course the transcript will be useful if your third case proceeds - I use a company called Posib, their website explains how to apply).

Payment: they will send you a cheque. They will probably need chasing.

Third case: yes, absolutely, do both. Explain that the claim arises from identical circumstances and therefore cannot succeed and invite the court to strike it out and the Claimant to discontinue it. Tell C you will agree to a discontinuance on a costs neutral basis (ie you will not seek costs) but if they continue and you have to defend it you will rely on today's outcome to seek Rule 27.14(2)(g) costs.

will do!

To be honest this forum saved me - I think I would have paid ages ago (especially if I continued to listen to the stupid solicitor I saw!).

I used the templates in here for WS and Skeleton argument and they were already tailored at residential so I just really appreciate whoever shared those and for making them easily available!!!

Laura_Higgs_76

Ralph-y wrote: »

Really well done .... :j

would you consider taking a few mins to support this campaign ....

(you may wish to wait the outcome of the third case if its not to far away)

Call for Action - submit evidence of private parking rip-offs Which? Magazine now! WHICH are asking again for consumer problems

https://whichcouk.bsd.net/page/s/which-taking-on-2018

Which are pretty good at hitting the government with
consumer problems.
No harm in them hearing from you, I have done it for
the great parking scam and their dodgly solicitors

Only takes a couple of mins



thanks


Ralph:cool:

Of course I will- more than happy to

Laura_Higgs_76

Loadsofchildren123 wrote: »

Some light reading for you.


Under CPR rule 3.4(2)(b) any further claim relating to the same issue should be struck out as an abuse of process


http://www.lawmentor.co.uk/glossary/R/res-judicata/


https://www.barkerbrettell.co.uk/common-sense-prevails-over-common-law-in-the-english-courts/


https://www.charlesrussellspeechlys.com/en/news-and-insights/insights/litigation--dispute-resolution/2014/to-re-litigate-or-not-to-re-litigate-that-is-the-question/


I think both "cause of action estoppel" and "issue estoppel" apply to you, so you'd argue them in the alternative (start with coae and then say if that doesn't apply then ie does).


So you need to write them a stiff letter telling them that under the legal principle res judicata the issue has already been adjudicated upon, that both cause of action estoppel and issue estoppel apply to the new claim and they cannot pursue it. If they attempt to, the new claim then you will apply for an immediate strike out under Rule 3.4. Tell them that they must discontinue, or you will apply for an immediate strikeout and will seek full indemnity costs, including the costs of applying for a transcript of the judgment of x date.
If you have incurred any costs so far in relation to this ticket/these proceedings? If so you could itemise them and ask them to pay you £x, or you could offer drop hands. Also point out that if they pursue this claim then you will apply for rule 27.14(2)(g) costs as their conduct is clearly unreasonable and the claim should never have been brought (separately or at all) and should have been discontinued immediately upon the judgment of the other claim.


If you have to issue an application you will have to do it on Form N244 and you will have to supply evidence (this is required to be in a witness statement, but the statement can really just repeat what's in the letter, and explain all about the first proceedings). Remember to ask for costs on the N244. There is a fee to pay: £255 if you want a hearing, £100 if you ask for it to be dealt with on paper. With your statement you should provide the transcript. The transcript will take some time because a transcript of a judgment has to be sent to the judge for approval, so it can take a month or more. So you need to tell them that they have 7 days to reply to your letter or you will apply for the transcript and you will seek to recover those costs from them in the event of a later discontinuance, or the claim being denied. I think you could reasonably expect the court to deal with this on paper so therefore pay the £100 fee. You'll get that back if you win, they will make a costs order in your favour. Remember though that you MUST seek costs in the application form itself.

Thanks so much - will prepare this today and send off!