Brexit, the economy and house prices (Part 3)

Tromking

BobQ wrote: »

No I accuse those who suggest that the EU is undemocratic of arrogance. Not all of us think that way,

I am not saying the EU is perfect, clearly its not and Barnier is I agree arrogant.

Sorry, I thought you suggested that arrogance was a particularly British trait. My mistake.

TrickyTree83

A_Medium_Size_Jock wrote: »

Now as someone admittedly more pro-leave than pro-remain and yet with a capacity to interpret facts & figures, some of your statements therein I must take issue with:

There is so far absolutely no evidence that we will be poorer outside the EU than in it - in fact the opposite does appear to be more likely on balance.

Remain supporters still haven't convinced me that I will lose anything from Brexit as opposed to remaining making us a bit poorer. Until some other EU poop hits the fan or some other fabrication is made and we get another request for additional funds, as has happened before. (£1.7 billion in 2014 for example.)

The language coming from senior Eurocrats is suggestive of the fear they have of losing a major contributor. There is absolutely no reason otherwise for the tone taken, as covered widely in threads within these very forums.

The talk of "blame" smacks of desperation - more-so given so far absolutely nothing has been agreed between ourselves and the EU regarding Brexit.
You might like predictions, but reality is often far different.
Once an outcome is known and if there remains any necessity to apportion blame you may do so if appropriate; beforehand is (politely) both premature and foolhardy.

FYI the above applies equally to both pro-remain and to pro-leave.
So far however any talk of impending doom flies in the face of statistical evidence.

Indeed, I noticed that the report from Deloitte on the German car industry indicating that in a WTO scenario the UK car industry will benefit from Brexit has been swept under the carpet in typical MSE fashion. A proper analysis given time to do their job on behalf of the German car industry shows WTO rules to be beneficial to the UK because NO ONE arguing against Brexit appears to consider the rest of the world - well Deloitte did, and it's grim for the Germans. And probably the French too.

That EU budget is looking weaker as the weeks go by.

And for those who think this is rubbish, go read it for yourself. The Guardian certainly didn't report it so don't bother with them. The Express did though.

BobQ

Tromking wrote: »

Sorry, I thought you suggested that arrogance was a particularly British trait. My mistake.

I think those Brits who exhibit this arrogance know who they are.

LHW99

However, for senior politicians like Verhofstadt and Juncker to be so openly disrespectful to the UK and the democratic vote has made me feel that we are probably better out of the EU.

Unfortunately the EU has form in this respect, if you consider the number of referendums where the voters gave "the wrong answer" and were sent to think again.

Arklight

Tromking wrote: »

I'm sorry Rusty but the majority of the above is just guilt-ridden leftist drivel. I'm 51 and have no such imperialist hangover and can't even remember a time when we lorded it over anyone. What we do possess, for good or ill is a fiercely independent spirit which does not lend itself kindly to being a supplicant member of a supranational entity like the EU.
I am personally looking forward to leaving the likes of Barnier, Verhofstadt and juncker behind. These Brit bashing political pygmies have no place in our national life IMO. Let them curry favour with the Germans and French by having a pop at the errant Poles or Hungarians in the future.

The English are one of the most conformist cultures on the planet. Something that has been exploited by England's (generally foreign) rulers for hundreds of years.

The jingoistic aspect of this is much less evident in the generations succeeding yours, which is why they weren't keen on the colossal nose spiting face exercise of the Brexit boomers.

gfplux

Tromking wrote: »

Give it up mate, you're beginning to sound desperate.

I am desperately looking for posts from people who actually have personal experience of good and less good things happening to the British economy since the Brexit referendum.
Up to now there are perhaps three posters who are able discuss their work and personal knowledge in a field that could be effected.
Everyone else including me have lots of opinions but are either retired (like me) or don't work.

buglawton

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Even the mighty Merkel in reality only polls around 28% of the German electorate. While appearing tough. She speaks in reality for a minority. Politics across much of Europe is splintered. While the UK's election system isn't perfect. At least it provides stability.

Err... Like the current 'Strong and Stable' government?

gfplux

Thrugelmir wrote: »

When you read the accompanying signature. Even more so. Rather omission in not saying that is an expat living in a low tax rate country though. I'm all right Jack. I've got my cake and I'm not letting go.

My signature says some of it. However I am not alright jack or Jill and why would you think that the Country I live in has low (personal) taxation.
Glad to see your post however as it is clearly Brexit Crisis related as Brexit could return Britain to the sick man of Europe.

CKhalvashi

gfplux wrote: »

My signature says some of it. However I am not alright jack or Jill and why would you think that the Country I live in has low (personal) taxation.
Glad to see your post however as it is clearly Brexit related as Brexit could return Britain to the sick man of Europe.

I'm sure the rates there aren't that much lower than the UK for income tax.

Corporate taxation is a different kettle of fish, however in the last few years the gap has IIRC significantly narrowed too.

As I've mentioned before, Ireland, Cyprus and Bulgaria could be considered Europe's tax havens now, and the former 2 have reasonably high income taxes.

Backbiter

TrickyTree83 wrote: »

Indeed, I noticed that the report from Deloitte on the German car industry indicating that in a WTO scenario the UK car industry will benefit from Brexit has been swept under the carpet in typical MSE fashion. A proper analysis given time to do their job on behalf of the German car industry shows WTO rules to be beneficial to the UK because NO ONE arguing against Brexit appears to consider the rest of the world - well Deloitte did, and it's grim for the Germans. And probably the French too.

That EU budget is looking weaker as the weeks go by.

And for those who think this is rubbish, go read it for yourself. The Guardian certainly didn't report it so don't bother with them. The Express did though.

Ford aren't exactly optimistic about the effects of the Brexit vote:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/ford-to-consider-closing-uk-factories-in-leave-towns-after-brexit-a7162561.html?amp

The price of Ford cars in the UK will also rise, according to Bob Shanks, chief financial officer, who blamed the changes on the tanking value of the pound against the dollar since the referendum. That has made Ford, a US brand, more expensive in the UK.
Carlos Tavares, the CEO of PSA Peugeot Citroen, warned on Wednesday that prices would have to rise in the UK.
“Everybody is now waiting for somebody to make the first step," he said.
Shanks said that Brexit had already cost Ford about $60 million in the second quarter with the cost for the year to run to $200 million. Each year until Britain leaves the EU would cost it $400 million to $500 million, the company said.