Brexit, the economy and house prices (Part 3)

fatbeetle

Italy is a role model of what can be achieved under the aegis of the monstrous EU bureaucracy..

Italy’s economy has shrunk by around 10 per cent since 2007, as the country endured a triple-dip recession.

Output has regressed to levels of over a decade ago. Overall unemployment is around 12-13 per cent, with youth unemployment around 40 per cent. Consumption and investment are flaccid.

The damage is long term, with as much as 15 per cent of Italian industrial capacity destroyed, reducing employment and growth potential. Once its strength, Italy’s smaller enterprises have contracted as a result of low sales, declining profitability and lack of financing.

Italy has a current account surplus of 1.9 per cent, reversing a number of years of deficits. The change reflects the deterioration of the Italian economy rather than a change in its trading position.

Gangaweed

So... just over a year later... how is the government handling Brexit so far?

Personally, though a Brexiteer, I think it is turning into a disaster with the Tories doing an atrocious job so far.

Thrugelmir

Much as expected. While politicians get bogged down in the battlefield mire of intransigence. Anybody with any sense simply just gets on making everyday decisions. Eventually we'll leave. Whatever the outcome. Life will go on.

System

fatbeetle wrote: »

Italy is a role model of what can be achieved under the aegis of the monstrous EU bureaucracy..

Aren't the UK subject to the same bureaucracy? We're doing alright aren't we?

Most bureaucracy in Italy is of their own making, Much like most of Greece's problems are due to voting in ineffective governments. The EU don't have a magic wand.

Thrugelmir

ilovehouses wrote: »

Aren't the UK subject to the same bureaucracy? We're doing alright aren't we?

Most bureaucracy in Italy is of their own making, Much like most of Greece's problems are due to voting in ineffective governments. The EU don't have a magic wand.

One then is left to wonder what value the bureaucracy in Brussels actually adds. If your scenario is indeed true.

BobQ

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Much as expected. While politicians get bogged down in the battlefield mire of intransigence. Anybody with any sense simply just gets on making everyday decisions. Eventually we'll leave. Whatever the outcome. Life will go on.

It will, it does after earthquakes. The question is what sort of life will it be?

norsefox

Badly. But pretty much as expected.

We're so incompetent we can't even do a bad deal properly, and at least allow someone to claim the morale high ground.

We'll end up with a half-cooked divorce agreement costing us money and political capital. Nothing will be gained. That is what happens when you put amateurs in charge without a plan.

But yes, as the above poster said, the rest of us will get on with it and history will show it to have been a massive waste of time.

Thrugelmir

BobQ wrote: »

It will, it does after earthquakes. The question is what sort of life will it be?

What you make it. As it's the individual actions of millions of people that will ultimately create the direction of travel.

Jason74

Gangaweed wrote: »

So... just over a year later... how is the government handling Brexit so far?

Personally, though a Brexiteer, I think it is turning into a disaster with the Tories doing an atrocious job so far.

Your quote here raises an interesting question for me. Had you known that things would turn out as they seem to be doing, would you have still voted leave ?.

I am very much a remainer, so the question doesn't come into it for me. But I'm curious whether those Brexit supporters who now see it as turning into a disaster would choose to accept what they see as the problems of EU rather than deal with the current mess, or whether they take a view that getting out of the EU is so important that it is worth whatever pain is suffered in order to achieve the higher goal.

There's no right answer to the above of course, I'm just genuinely curious how you (and other brexiteers who are unhappy with how things have been handled) see things at the moment.

A_Medium_Size_Jock

Jason74 wrote: »

Your quote here raises an interesting question for me. Had you known that things would turn out as they seem to be doing, would you have still voted leave ?.

I am very much a remainer, so the question doesn't come into it for me. But I'm curious whether those Brexit supporters who now see it as turning into a disaster would choose to accept what they see as the problems of EU rather than deal with the current mess, or whether they take a view that getting out of the EU is so important that it is worth whatever pain is suffered in order to achieve the higher goal.

There's no right answer to the above of course, I'm just genuinely curious how you (and other brexiteers who are unhappy with how things have been handled) see things at the moment.

I'm guessing you didn't read this from Friday?
"Most Remain voters now back taking control of borders, leaving ECJ and paying no Brexit divorce bill"

A major survey of more than 20,000 people revealed that an overwhelming majority of voters now prefer a so-called “hard Brexit” to a soft one.
Almost 70 per cent of people said they preferred a deal with the European Union which ended membership of the single market, ongoing payments and continued freedom of movement.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/08/11/remain-voters-now-back-taking-control-borders-leaving-ecj-paying/

It looks like your answer is that a majority actually want Brexit more than they did in the referendum.
Okay, yes it's a survey but it's a sizeable one, at over 3000 respondents apparently (Not the 20,000 stated in the link.).

An earlier version of this story misstated that the researchers surveyed 20,000 people.

https://www.buzzfeed.com/jamesball/remain-and-leave-voters-are-surprisingly-united-on-backing?utm_term=.wnQmD6gOEJ#.hq46QbDnkB