So I'm going to court...

Jhpt

At risk of sounding like a broken record - thank you!

Have printed that off.

I'm collating my evidence bundle now if this does go all the way to court and I have a few questions;

1) When referencing case law i.e. Beavis etc. - do I include the whole judgement? I seem to have a 100+ page PDF and unsure whether to include it all or just highlight relevant sections?

2) formatting for exhibits - page numbered and titled I assume - anything else weird and wonderful?

Coupon-mad

I think LOC123 will confirm, for that judgment - being very well known and a Supreme Court decision - you don't need to take it to court. So, if you choose to highlight certain paragraphs from the decision as handed down, you will only need the page(s) you want.

Exhibits, yes page numbered, and titled, and give each exhibit a number identifier (e.g. Jhpt1, then Jhpt2, etc.) so you can refer to the exhibit by number when you write your Witness Statement - the story of what you can confirm to be the facts of the case, not the legal argument - a few weeks before the hearing.

The WS and evidence are best in an ordered file or document wallet with a contents page at the front, with the exhibit numbers, to make it very easy for the Judge to turn to a page.

Loadsofchildren123

At the start of your statement:
I, Loadsofchildren, of [address] WILL SAY as follows:
1. I am the Defendant in this matter.......
2. With this Statement is a paginated bundle of documents marked LOC1 to which I will refer by page number. [OR if you prefer to number each individually you say With this Stmt are exhibits marked LOC1-23 to which I will refer in this Statement).


I prefer one paginated exhibit - in the body of the WS you then refer to the docs like this (I've put in the 2 alteratives depending on how you prefer to do it):


When I came back to the car I found a PCN on my windscreen (page 1 of LOC1/ exhibit LOC1)....


I looked around and noticed a sign (a photograph of the only visible sign from where the car was parked, taken on the same day, is at page 2 of LOC1/ is at LOC2)


When I received correspondence about the charge, I wrote to the Claimant asking it to produce information about where the car was parked and its signage [etc] and a copy of the letter is at page 3 of LOC1/LOC3. No response was ever received.


Etc.
Your statement will of course be different, I'm merely trying to illustrate the correct wording/format.


As CM says, put it in a ringbinder with a paginated index so it's easy for the DJ to navigate it and find what he wants.

Loadsofchildren123

If you have a lengthy judgment, just have the relevant extracts, with the bits you want to refer to highlighted.
You should have the full version available to the DJ.
However, Beavis fills almost an entire lever arch.
I would take the full version in case you get a stroppy judge, but I'm of the ilk who takes everything including the kitchen sink to court with me. Have it with you but don't put it in your bundle (in the bundle just put the relevant bits)
The easiest way of transporting your stuff on the day is in a wheely suitcase, like the ones you use as cabin baggage on aeroplanes. They are really convenient and fit loads of files and papers in them and all lawyers use them now.

Jhpt

Evening all,

apologies in the delay getting back to you - been working manically all weekend so only just had the chance to review the responses.

That all seems clear - as I say I think if I was to include every page of each judgement this would mean 290+ pages - I will highlight the relevant parts and ask the judge to turn to page x,y,z rather than say read all 111 pages etc! Makes sense I hope!

Finally last questions re: WS

1- purely a statement of facts i.e. I own car, car was parked X, ticket recieved X
- so therefore "the inclusion of case x made the inexperienced defendant feel intimidated" would NOT go in WS (SA perhaps?)
2 - I WILL include the fact my lease includes right to park etc.

Skeleton Argument however;
1 - flesh out each point of my defence - I think I have ~7 seperate reasons as to why I am not liable for the alleged debt i.e. primacy of contract etc - explain each of these and provide the relevant reference to exhibit as appropriate here
2 - Away from a purely factual basis - how a serial litigant has attempted to intimidate an inexperienced defendant into paying by threatening "local" debt recovery and referencing several pieces of case law (despite them being found inapplicable for residential car parking) and how this is imoral on their part.
3 - More subjective factors i.e. poor display of signage i.e. not at enterance, not lit at night etc


Would you guys be so kind to take a look over both my WS and SA this week when completed?

Lamilad

Would you guys be so kind to take a look over both my WS and SA this week when completed?

Of course, but bear in mind you may not get instant feedback and you may need to keep bumping it up the forum listings.

It takes time to read and fully evaluate a WS or SA so it's a case of waiting til a regular can have a proper look at it. Also depends how busy the forum is.

Keep bumping and you will get a response.

Loadsofchildren123

I'd put point 2 in your WS, and 3.
The WS is the FACTS, not the legal argument. Both of these are factual.
Anything that isn't either in your defence or your WS can't go in your SA (unless it's in response to their WS which you obviously haven't seen yet)

Jhpt

Thanks guys. Slightly new issue has reared it's head.

I've written to the Estate Agent and the Resident's Association asking for them to write a letter (Or request this directly from the Landlord - the terms of my lease prevent me contacting my landlord directly) to say that I'm a resident, have a legal right to park within the resident's car park and therefore do NOT support or endorse the PPC's behaviour.

However the resident association director "doesn't want to get involved" and won't return any of my calls. The estate agent has said "if your permit wasn't displayed we can't help" - I've reminded them there is no reference to permits or third party contractors/operators within my lease and primacy of contract etc. but they're sticking to the party line and refusing to pass my concerns on to my landlord.

What's the best course of action? LBC?

safarmuk

the terms of my lease prevent me contacting my landlord directly

You might also remind the Estate Agent that the terms of your lease probably allow for "quiet and peaceful enjoyment" (check it) of the property for the term of the AST. The clause about contacting the landlord is primarily so you don't cut out the Estate Agent.

However the resident association director "doesn't want to get involved" and won't return any of my calls.

What reason did he give for not wanting to get involved?
Have you checked with any of your neighbours to see if they have run into these problems as well?

Loadsofchildren123

safarmuk wrote: »

You might also remind the Estate Agent that the terms of your lease probably allow for "quiet and peaceful enjoyment" (check it) of the property for the term of the AST. The clause about contacting the landlord is primarily so you don't cut out the Estate Agent.

Yes, that clause doesn't mean that you have no recourse if the terms of your tenancy are breached. Even if it doesn't specify a right to peaceful enjoyment, this is an implied term.


You could tell the estate agent that this isn't good enough and that you will either join the landlord to the proceedings and seek an indemnity for him, or will sue him subsequently for all your losses and for damages for breaching your rights under the tenancy.


The tenancy doesn't say that you have to display a permit, and nor does the landlord's lease. Even if the landlord's lease allows new "regulations" to be introduced, these have to be within the definition of such regulations, and even if they are, the right of the freeholder or its agent(s) to introduce new regulations will not extend to unilaterally imposing a liability to a third party (the parking co), or the right to impose a set charge for failure to comply (the lease will only allow the freeholder to recover amounts as defined in the lease - usually limited to ground rent and service charge.



Of course, the difficulty here is you might not want to threaten your landlord with suing him because he may then serve notice on you. So you are a bit between a rock and a hard place. But your only other choice is to just fight the ticket and not rely on the landlord at all. Personally I'd just go for it with the landlord - he will have this problem with whatever tenant he has because humans are fallible and everyone will forget their permit from time to time, or it will fall down, and he has to take responsibility for what is going on at his flat.


Tell the estate agent you will sue the landlord/join him to proceedings, you don't want to do that, all you want is a letter from him or them confirming the tenancy includes a right to park and that it does not include any obligation to display a permit. If they won't help tell them that the clause in your tenancy saying you can't contact landlord doesn't extend to legal claims and you'll be writing him a Letter Before Claim.


Then write a nice letter to your landlord (not a formal LBC) explaining what has happened and telling him what you want from him. Explain about the proceedings and what you believe your rights are under the tenancy and how they are being breached, that you don't want to involve him and at this stage you just want a letter from him confirming x, y and z.