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Smart (or dumb?) parking - help with pcn

Hi All,

I have read the Newbies thread, but still need a little bit of advice before corresponding with dumb parking. If anyone would be so kind as to assist I would be most grateful.

I am the registered keeper of the vehicle in question and the PCN is addressed to me, but I am not the only person who drives the car.

The location on the letter simply states "TOSCANA RETAIL PARK" no other location info at all.

The only info I can find online is that Toscana Retail Park is in Bangor, Ireland. I live in West Yorkshire...both myself and the vehicle have never been to Ireland.

The newbies thread suggests to first get in touch with the land owner, but there is no conclusive info for "TOSCANA RETAIL PARK" that I can find.

I am hesitant to contact them to get this information without asking on here first.

I am also hesitant to send the "Template appeal for BPA members" as this suggests I am arguing with their signage before the location has been established.

Many thanks in advance! :beer:
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Comments

  • Umkomaas
    Umkomaas Posts: 43,468 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    edited 7 July 2017 at 10:10AM
    Smart Parking do operate in NI. I can find no previous Smart/Toscana cases on this forum (or in a Google search).

    Does the NtK show photos of the car? Can you read the VRM plate. Is this a case of an incorrect transcription of the VRM which has elicited your data from the DVLA rather than that of the person whose car was actually parked at Toscana?

    I would write a strong letter of complaint to Smart, telling them that neither you nor your car have been anywhere near this car park in NI and ask them to double check their information and inform you of the outcome of their check. Ensure you copy your complaint to the BPA and David Dunford of the DVLA (mark each letter with a list of the recipients of your cc, so none of them can deny knowledge of this).

    Once Smart come back with an apology, you will then issue a Letter of Claim for £250 (maybe more) for the incorrect use of your personal data by breaching the Data Protection Act principle. They have 'previous'.

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/11/smart-parking-settle-out-of-court-for.html

    You will inform both the BPA and the DVLA of the Smart response and ask that punitive sanctions are implemented against Smart.

    Complaints to the BPA and DVLA can be emailed to:

    aos@britishparking.co.uk

    or (if posting)

    British Parking Association
    Stuart House
    41-43 Perrymount Road
    Haywards Heath
    West Sussex
    RH16 3BN

    and DVLA:

    FOI@dvla.gsi.gov.uk

    david.dunford@dvla.gsi.gov.uk

    Please come back and keep us informed of progress.
    Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask. .

    I provide only my personal opinion, it is not a legal opinion, it is simply a personal one. I am not a lawyer.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.

    Private Parking Firms - Killing the High Street
  • samb0b
    samb0b Posts: 25 Forumite
    edited 7 July 2017 at 10:25AM
    Yes, the PCN does clearly show the registration of my vehicle. Do you think I should I still proceed as you have advised? Many thanks!
  • samb0b
    samb0b Posts: 25 Forumite
    I have gone ahead and emailed dumb parking, including a cc to aos@britishparking.co.uk, FOI@dvla.gsi.gov.uk & david.dunford@dvla.gsi.gov.uk

    Dear Sir/Madam,

    I would like to raise a complaint regarding a letter I have received from your company containing a "PCN" alleging an "unauthorised parking" contravention at the location "TOSCANA RETAIL PARK" demanding payment of £100.

    The letter did not detail any further location information so I have looked up TOSCANA RETAIL PARK on line and have found that it is a retail park in Bangor, Northern Ireland

    I HAD PUT LINKS TO LOCATION FROM GOOGLE HERE - (It wouldn't let me post the web addresses as I am a new user)

    I can assure you that I have never been to Northern Ireland, let alone this retail park.

    I am outraged that I have received this correspondence, including the incorrect use of my personal data. This has caused my wife and I, undue stress and anxiety.

    I can only assume that your company has made an error, and I trust you will address this promptly.

    I look forward to your speedy reply.

    Yours
  • Umkomaas
    Umkomaas Posts: 43,468 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    edited 7 July 2017 at 11:03AM
    samb0b wrote: »
    Yes, the PCN does clearly show the registration of my vehicle. Do you think I should I still proceed as you have advised? Many thanks!

    ANPR camera pictures are sometimes digitally enhanced automatically by the software. Can you determine whether the car in the photo is the same make and model as yours?

    You must proceed with your complaint. Tell them that it would have been a physical impossibility for your car to have been in NI that day. Do you know where you and your car actually were? Do you have a dash cam with footage? Do you have a smartphone because some actually track your movements? Do you have a witness(es) who can vouch for you and your car's whereabouts?

    If you have any of the above, I'd just put in the complaint that you have irrefutable proof that you were not in (and have never been to) NI.

    Does your VRM include any digits that could possibly be misread (3 can sometimes look like an 8 from certain angles, a C a G, and so on)?

    The other possibility might be that it's been a simple error by Smart in identifying the car park. Were you in a Smart run car park that day nearer to home? Maybe they've just put the wrong address in. If that's the case, they will not be able/allowed to correct that, and you'll win an appeal (probably at the POPLA stage).

    Just keep the foregoing paragraph up your sleeve at the moment - don't offer it to Smart, just see what they come up with in the context of NI.
    Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask. .

    I provide only my personal opinion, it is not a legal opinion, it is simply a personal one. I am not a lawyer.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.

    Private Parking Firms - Killing the High Street
  • samb0b
    samb0b Posts: 25 Forumite
    Yes, I am 100% confident that I can prove that I or the car was not in NI that day! (I've never been to Ireland!)

    The reg does contain S's and 5's which I guess could be misread, but even from the small grainy black and white pictures they have included, it does look like my car I must admit.

    After talking to my wife I think I know which car park it may have been. There is now a SMART in my local village which was previously council owned / run.

    However, the letter does not give any details of this whatsoever, so I believe I have taken the correct course of action.

    I will update once they get back to me with a response.

    many thanks for your time and advice!
  • I think it might be the coop car park in Saltaire as it has changed form Bradford council.
  • samb0b
    samb0b Posts: 25 Forumite
    Possibly. I will wait to see what their response is as they should have included basic location information.
  • I've just got my second pcn through for "Toscana retail park" in the space of a few days, probably more to follow. I will be sending the same emails as I've never been there.
  • Umkomaas
    Umkomaas Posts: 43,468 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    Lengrant wrote: »
    I've just got my second pcn through for "Toscana retail park" in the space of a few days, probably more to follow. I will be sending the same emails as I've never been there.

    Seems like there's a problem at Smart HQ here. Could suggest the need for a complaint to the DVLA and BPA.

    No due care applied in the issuing of these tickets. They just throw the pebble into the pond, then it's entirely down to the motorist to deal with the erupting wave-swell.

    No conscience, no responsibility, no shame, just pay us the money!
    Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask. .

    I provide only my personal opinion, it is not a legal opinion, it is simply a personal one. I am not a lawyer.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.

    Private Parking Firms - Killing the High Street
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 153,177 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    Lengrant wrote: »
    I've just got my second pcn through for "Toscana retail park" in the space of a few days, probably more to follow. I will be sending the same emails as I've never been there.

    Seriously, you both - you and the OP - need to also APPEAL, not just email, unless that is a valid method of appeal to Smart, is it? Just checking.

    Do not say who was driving, but appeal as keeper in the way the PCN tells you.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top or bottom of any page where it says:
    Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
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