Brexit, The Economy and House Prices (Part 2)

CKhalvashi

kabayiri wrote: »

It does seen inconsistent.

Eg, it may come down to using cheap labour to assemble a future electric car here or China.

I don't care where anything is built as long as it does the job. The vehicles in question are the best tool for the job at the right price, and if you want further proof of that, ask any courier company as most seem to be using them.

We sing the praises of cheap hard working EE workers, but don't welcome even cheaper labour from elsewhere in the world.

I believe that everyone should be paid the same for the same job, I have never hinted otherwise. If someone from any country isn't willing to work for a fair wage, then that's their choice.

Maybe CK is right. I don't know if there is the appetite for UK to go down the Hong Kong route. I can only see a slow withering demise, much like the EU.

I don't think it's right for any country to have to survive by cutting taxes and lowering wages to stay ahead. HK hasn't directly done this so isn't a perfect example, however is probably the closest to how May wants to go.

We could have a 5% CT, however IMO that will lead businesses here for tax only, before moving onto the next one to undercut it. I believe in building foundations based on loyalty and only adjusting that in extreme circumstances. We could create ideal trading conditions inside the EU by assisting the EU in dealing with its faults instead of leaving. This would benefit 28 countries instead of allowing 27 to plod along and potentially significantly harming the 1 left.

I'm sorry, but I don't think the risk of this one outweighs any potential reward.

kabayiri wrote: »

So you recognise your EU bias?

I recognise that I believe remaining in the EU is best for the country. I don't believe that is bias.

I also recognise that it's best for my own pocket, however again, I feel that it's likely to be best for the whole of the UK. I have explained why I feel this many times.

I get that. It's why Brexit has raised such different opinions.

I appreciate that. There is one person I can think of immediately who wants roughly the same for the UK as I do. She voted Leave, I voted Remain.

We are attacking the same problem and aiming for the same result from different angles and I respect that. What I don't respect is the attitudes of some in removing the UK from the worlds largest internal market, one with some of the most far reaching trade deals in the world as 'we don't sell enough to those with the trade deals'.

One of those countries is the country I originate from, which is a country with huge development potential both domestically and for re-export. Why are we not doing more to increase trade in a country with huge potential? Please do answer this as I can't understand it, and no one I've spoken to has seen any British companies openly touting for business in the last year (which is unusual considering past experiences, taking into account that my social circle is reasonably senior and reasonably broad).

Did you notice that China was in the bidding to run HS2? There is clearly interest in the UK from outside Europe. It's easy to get burned dealing with Chinese companies though.

So, lets do business with China through ambitious trade deals, whilst inside the single market but outside the customs union. It's not what I want or my ideal situation, but it is a good mid-point to keep both of us happy it seems.

Genuinely I'd like your opinion on the above, as I feel it will help us get a better understanding of the feelings each of us face on the situation. We can't learn from each other without honest cooperation and negotiation.

CKhalvashi

ilovehouses wrote: »

I think it's extremely important we leave the customs union. I'm sick of hearing about how there's a big old queue of countries wanting to do more business with us but being prevented from doing so because we're EU members.

The Brexiteers have to be given chance to deliver on their promises.

However we can do more business with them despite being in the EU.

People were trusting Vote Leave and Leave.eu to give us the promise of being like Norway and Switzerland and it is up to the government to deliver on that. If not, I want to see Nigel Farage and the others who said it, plus anyone who backed them prosecuted for Electoral Fraud regarding the referendum.

sevenhills

ilovehouses wrote: »

I think it's extremely important we leave the customs union. I'm sick of hearing about how there's a big old queue of countries wanting to do more business with us but being prevented from doing so because we're EU members.

The Brexiteers have to be given chance to deliver on their promises.

There may be an opportunity for politicians to offer a referendum when things start to decline, there will be a transition period of 2+ years.

Fella

Funny, I've read many crowing posts on here in the last month saying how "hard Brexit was dead & buried".

Guess not eh?

Conrad

sevenhills wrote: »

There may be an opportunity for politicians to offer a referendum when things start to decline, there will be a transition period of 2+ years.

Things won't decline, it's an utter myth. For us to be harmed would require Germany, France Holland and other core exporters to the UK to harm thier own trade. Lots of reports are comming out of these nations saying the self harm would be unacceptable.

When oh when will Remainers ever understand this point?

Conrad

mayonnaise wrote: »

Yes.
Let's either have a full, hard Brexit...or no Brexit at all.
No halfway house solution where disaffected brexiteering little englanders will still have a reason to blame their inadequacies on whatever still links us to the EU.

But again Remainers have everything all mixed up. A hard Brexit does not mean we won't have a mutually beneficial relationship with Europe, it means being a grown up nation like Canada but with a better trade deal off the back of the fact core EU nations do massively more trade with the U.K.

If only Remainers could get behind Brexit life for all of us would be more positive. The Economist woman on QT was a classic case of an insider unable to see wood for trees, wedded to old realities.

Conrad

CKhalvashi wrote: »

However we can do more business with them despite being in the EU.

People were trusting Vote Leave and Leave.eu to give us the promise of being like Norway and Switzerland and it is up to the government to deliver on that. If not, I want to see Nigel Farage and the others who said it, plus anyone who backed them prosecuted for Electoral Fraud regarding the referendum.

And Remainers like Clegg endlessly said a Norway tpe deal was worst of all worlds, fax democracy, having to abide by rules without a say on them.
Ive explained this many times why do you keep ignoring it?

mayonnaise

Conrad wrote: »

If only Remainers could get behind Brexit life for all of us would be more positive.

Don't be daft.
Why should we get behind something that is harmful to our country?
Isn't that unpatriotic?

CKhalvashi

Conrad wrote: »

If only Remainers could get behind Brexit life for all of us would be more positive. The Economist woman on QT was a classic case of an insider unable to see wood for trees, wedded to old realities.

I'm not going to get behind something I think is a bad idea and badly thought out.

Conrad wrote: »

And Remainers like Clegg endlessly said a Norway tpe deal was worst of all worlds, fax democracy, having to abide by rules without a say on them.
Ive explained this many times why do you keep ignoring it?

I said it's not ideal. I also said it's better than where we are heading now. I've explained this many times, so why do you keep ignoring it?

mayonnaise

Fella wrote: »

Funny, I've read many crowing posts on here in the last month saying how "hard Brexit was dead & buried".

Guess not eh?

You might have noticed the rhetoric on both sides of the house changing to 'jobs first Brexit' and 'economy first Brexit'.
Never underestimate our political classes' ability to turn this into one big convoluted mess.