Brexit, The Economy and House Prices (Part 2)

A_Medium_Size_Jock

setmefree2 wrote: »

http://www.cityam.com/267504/eu-considers-new-taxes-scratches-its-head-over-budget


I still can't believe they were dumb enough to let us walk.....

They'll soon run out of multinationals to fine megabucks - oops sorry, mega-Euro's .................. or maybe one will fight back.
Interesting times ahead either way.

Alphabet General Counsel Kent Walker said in an emailed statement to MarketWatch: "We respectfully disagree with the conclusions announced today. We will review the Commission's decision in detail as we consider an appeal, and we look forward to continuing to make our case."

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/google-respectfully-disagrees-with-eus-27-billion-fine-and-will-consider-an-appeal-2017-06-27

Thrugelmir

A_Medium_Size_Jock wrote: »

That seems to be true in those cases.
But I wonder if it's possibly not just a backlash against their dire continual advertising?

How many sofas does one need?

How often is flooring replaced?

I only gave those 2 companies as examples. Sofa's are a highly profitable line of business for man of the major high street retailers and department stores.

The new car bubble will burst sooner or later. As all that shiny new metal will soon be secondhand. Offering good value.

kabayiri

ilovehouses wrote: »

Quite. However, the on-topic point was that you suggested there was no evidence that looking outside the EU for labour would be any more expensive.
...

The world is awash with labour, and if you drop the minimum wage constraints you could bring them in for cheap.

3.2 billion people on this planet exist on what we would consider extreme poverty incomes.

Sure, they would come. If they are willing to head to places like Qatar, with rubbish safety standards, they will come here.

I'm sure I will be condemned as heartless for saying this again.

kabayiri

Thrugelmir wrote: »

How many sofas does one need?
...

Another one here

We only buy from reputable UK made sources though. I don't fancy any donkey skin masquerading as leather..

gfplux

A_Medium_Size_Jock wrote: »

Like many others it would appear that you too do not realise that these migrant workers are, by and large, already here.
They are already doing the work.
Now if millions do indeed return from whence they came it is quite obvious that whoever replaces these workers if they come from outside the UK are not really new migrants, they are replacements for those that have returned.

EU workers who, it may be correct, expect a higher wage than the UK now provides due to exchange rates being lower, may well choose other EU countries in which to work - although unemployment is mostly already higher in the rest of the EU than in the UK so that might not be easy.

The UK however may import workers to replace those wishing to move from wherever we want globally, allowing far more freedom of choice than being restricted to the EU.
There is absolutely no reason why using workers from elsewhere should cost the UK more than EU workers; I have seen zero evidence to support claims from some quarters that it will.

This IMHO is an area where - if the EU is not very careful - the EU will potentially suffer greatly by further increasing their unemployment rates.
The recently-mentioned one million plus "thinking" of leaving the UK; where will they go inside EU boundaries and will they have jobs to go to?

I do agree with this.

"The UK however may import workers to replace those wishing to move from wherever we want globally, allowing far more freedom of choice than being restricted to the EU.
There is absolutely no reason why using workers from elsewhere should cost the UK more than EU workers; I have seen zero evidence to support claims from some quarters that it will."

Britain must guard against falling inbetween the two systems.
EU workers presently coming and going from Britain and your suggestion that The UK may import workers to replace them.

The British Government have until March 2019 to build a new "seasonal worker Visa" system. That system should tho be in place well before Britain leaves the EU.
The present EU seasonal workers numbers might reduce month by month, season by season as we move to March 2019

This will take joined up Government and I have seen little of that from any British Government of any colour.

I hope your faith in a smooth transition is sound otherwise there may be no industry left for the "new" group of seasonal workers to work in.

gfplux

Herzlos wrote: »

Noone is suggesting that our food won't get picked. Just that since we're making it harder to source staff, it'll get more expensive and some of it will potentially become unviable, where we'll just import it instead.

If we can get the staff, it's down to 2 things: increased prices or immigration. Since the Leavers are so keen to get immigration down to impossible figures for some reason, that only leaves price increases. No?

Or do you still maintain that once all these foreigners stop coming to do the seasonal work, our (record low) unemployed will pick up the shortfall despite losing their benefits / being incapable / being unwilling?

I am actually suggesting that it "could" be possible the food will not be picked or processed.
The Government need to manage the process.
The unintended consequence of fewer EU workers month by month as we head to March 2019 and those workers either issued with new "seasonal visa" together with "seasonal visa" being issued to workers from other parts of the world.
It is highly unlikely but the consequences of it being mismanaged could/would be disastrous.

kabayiri

ilovehouses wrote: »

Sure, there are plenty of desperate people in the world for who living in a tented community and earning £4/ hour would be a dream. I just don't think it'll wash.
...

They will find a way here though (well a certain percentage).

3.2 billion is a staggering figure, but if we assume even 100 million of those are mobile, then that's a significant number of potential migrants.

Europe is already seeing these people arriving by sea or land on the Eastern and Southern border.

...Even as I write this, I don't know the answer long term. Some of these challenges seem insurmountable.

I would take the £80bn spend on HS2 and invest in to one or two African countries to create a self sustaining economy, but the chances of it working must be low. Corruption is rife.

kabayiri

ilovehouses wrote: »

...
The referendum campaign wasn't that long ago and I distinctly remember immigration was a running theme. Yes, we're all talking about the ECJ and the status of current EU residents now but my feeling at the time was that people wanted less immigrants rather than a different sort.
...

We (UK) have never really had a nuanced and balanced conversation about migration in general I reckon.

It doesn't take long before people expect you to take one of 2 extreme positions. There isn't much middle ground in the discussion.

I've spent most of my working life with workers from the Asian sub continent, so why wouldn't I be focussed on those people rather than Europeans? It depends on your perspective.

gfplux

setmefree2 wrote: »

Indeed.



Nuts tbh. Particularly in a country that seems incapable of building homes.

Or roads and other infrastructure.

gfplux

If the British Government are to create a "seasonal worker visa" it should be remembered that there is a good possibility of an EU worker returning home at the end of the contract.
What chance that someone from a part of the world where five dollars a day is a good wage wanting to return home after earning the British minimum wage for six months?
Britain might solve one problem only to create another. Interestingly they would not be able to "escape" across the Channel as they will have no travel papers and entering the EU from Britain will in future be less easy than it is today.