Smart Meters

System

Deleted_User wrote: »

This all sounds very interesting and no doubt what your saying is probably correct. However I am just an ordinary consumer and I simply want to be able to find a way of reading my meters remotely so I can view and supply a gas and electricity meter reading from time to time. I'd like the readings to be displayed in the correct units as required energy suppliers. So if my display says the meter reading is xxxxx I want to be able to pass the figure xxxxx on without having to do extensive research or jump though hoops involving complex conversions. Please see my new thread:
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/72511857#Comment_72511857

If your meter is passing back readings to the supplier then why do you need to read the meter? If everything is working as intended, then you should never have to access your meter again. In the unlikely event that your smart meter is sending back inaccurate meter readings, then any reading that you see on the IHD (if this was possible) or on the meter itself would be also be in error.

If you have an analogue meter with an optical spot, then there are 3rd party meter reading devices such as:

LoopEnergy, NorthQ and Smappee

Pincher

If I was running the country, I would have double metering.

One outside the premises, somewhere near the pavement, probably at natural spur/branching points.

The meter or meters inside the premises would provide a verification function. All are smart connected devices.

When the sums don't add up, send in the engineers.

The only problem is, that means hitherto hidden abuses will have to be dealt with, and they can't handle the truth.

[Deleted User]

Hengus wrote: »

If your meter is passing back readings to the supplier then why do you need to read the meter? If everything is working as intended, then you should never have to access your meter again.

You're missing the fact that the whole idea of having an IHD to show meter readings will give me the option to switch suppliers. Currently the switching option is not available to me as I'll then be back to the Flintstone age with the scourge of estimated bills.

[Deleted User]

@picks
The meter itself has a display and that does show the correct units. You can go to the meter and press the buttons to go through the display and get to the actual meter reading. The gas meter has the volume reading you need to send to a suppler.
The IHD is designed with the meter itself so its functionality is not upgrade-able by getting another IHD from a different source. And the make of meter installed is not something that a consumer can influence.

System

Deleted_User wrote: »

You're missing the fact that the whole idea of having an IHD to show meter readings will give me the option to switch suppliers. Currently the switching option is not available to me as I'll then be back to the Flintstone age with the scourge of estimated bills.

You can still switch suppliers. All suppliers will take on a customer with a smart meter, you just have to read it manually.What you are asking for is just not going to happen. IHDs were only brought in as a way of making the projected savings work; i.e., consumers will be scared by the £ sign and turn down their heating.

[Deleted User]

Hengus wrote: »

You can still switch suppliers. All suppliers will take on a customer with a smart meter, you just have to read it manually.

You're missing the fact that reading my meters manually is not practical. See thread:
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/72511857#Comment_72511857

EachPenny

victor2 wrote: »

I don't know how they communicate either, but I would have thought that relying on some sort of consumption "pulse" is fraught with possible errors. How does the IHD get its first reading? What happens when the IHD misses a signal and/or is powered down when a signal should have been processed?

That was the point, what I was suggesting is the IHD never gets a reading, it just listens out for the pulse signal with whatever encoding or frequency it was told to look for when paired with the meter.

If it is only expected to produce an approximation of consumption, and with the focus on the rate of consumption in terms of £££'s (see the post by Hengus below) then it is sufficient to count the number of pulses per time (say a minute) and display the rate of consumption. It is easy then to just total the number of pulses or use an integration calculation to work out an approximate total consumption per hour/day/week etc.

Missing the occasional pulse signal will have little effect on the accuracy of an approximated consumption figure, but would be a major issue if the data were used to generate meter readings on the IHD - in time there would be a drift between the readings on the meter and the IHD and this would be unacceptable. I'm speculating this is why meter readings aren't given on IHD's.

Rubidium

EachPenny wrote: »

That was the point, what I was suggesting is the IHD never gets a reading, it just listens out for the pulse signal with whatever encoding or frequency it was told to look for when paired with the meter.

If it is only expected to produce an approximation of consumption, and with the focus on the rate of consumption in terms of £££'s (see the post by Hengus below) then it is sufficient to count the number of pulses per time (say a minute) and display the rate of consumption. It is easy then to just total the number of pulses or use an integration calculation to work out an approximate total consumption per hour/day/week etc.

Missing the occasional pulse signal will have little effect on the accuracy of an approximated consumption figure, but would be a major issue if the data were used to generate meter readings on the IHD - in time there would be a drift between the readings on the meter and the IHD and this would be unacceptable. I'm speculating this is why meter readings aren't given on IHD's.

I think that we can safely state that the IHD does get a reading in M3 from the gas meter via the hub associated with the electric meter, which provides readings to the supplier.

The various committees who designed the specification obviously decided that M3 units are meaningless to joe public and that they needed to be converted into kWh for us before displaying and to enable the cost calculations to be displayed.

This IHD screen shows that it has the calorific value which is variable and the conversion factor used to calculate the kWh that is displayed:

EachPenny

Rubidium wrote: »

I think that we can safely state that the IHD does get a reading in M3 from the gas meter via the hub associated with the electric meter, which provides readings to the supplier.

The discussion was about the register value on the meter, or what is generally known as a 'reading'. The complaint is the IHD doesn't display the meter register values, so these 'readings' cannot be sent to the supplier if the meter goes dumb, without accessing the actual meters.

The IHD does get some data in M3 units, but it isn't clear what that data represents - I'm speculating it may just be a pulse signal to indicate a further 1/100 or 1/1000M3 etc of gas has been used since the last pulse was sent - so the IHD has no idea what the register actually shows and therefore cannot display it remotely.

Rubidium

EachPenny wrote: »

The discussion was about the register value on the meter, or what is generally known as a 'reading'. The complaint is the IHD doesn't display the meter register values, so these 'readings' cannot be sent to the supplier if the meter goes dumb, without accessing the actual meters.

The IHD does get some data in M3 units, but it isn't clear what that data represents - I'm speculating it may just be a pulse signal to indicate a further 1/100 or 1/1000M3 etc of gas has been used since the last pulse was sent - so the IHD has no idea what the register actually shows and therefore cannot display it remotely.

Yes I have read the thread and fully understand the complaint regarding not displaying the M3 register on the IHD.

I think that you can forget your Monty Python theory, as it is simply not how it works in reality.