Grade 2 - should we reconsider our offer?

redhead123

That was for 3 windows - one a double fronted huge bay, another a small side window and the rear double glazed UPVC one. I am not sure about inside - but the agent selling my house sold that house to the current vendor and said something about the kitchen used to be a barn/outbuilding. The bathroom is upstairs so I wonder if that has been changed!

It just seems like a minefield!
I checked the postcode on the planning approvals website and the only thing I could find under listed buildings consent for that property was this

8/13620/REPWIN | Data transfer from replacement windows database

...and I have no idea what that means!!!

redhead123

trailingspouse wrote: »

I think the OPs problem is not so much with the issues surrounding Grade II status, but with the fact that they feel the vendors haven't been upfront with them.

All I can suggest is that you go back to the estate agent and say exactly that - you were disappointed to find that there had been alterations where perhaps permission should have been sought but it wasn't. Apologise for 'dropping them in it' but explain that you never imagined they wouldn't have had permission... And see what the reaction is.

If, at the end of the day, you feel you just don't trust the vendors then all you can do is walk away. Other listed buildings are available - and there are lots of characterful buildings that aren't listed.

There is nothing on the planning applications site- I checked over the years - only 8/13620/REPWIN | Data transfer from replacement windows database

Whatever that means! THe kitchen may be a converted barn building..........................!

redhead123

SG27 wrote: »

How many windows is that for?

Ask your solicitor to ask the vendors what work if any has been carried out on the property since they have owned it. Then check on the council website for listed building consent. They could lie of course but there would at least be possible legal recourse if you needed it in future.

The work to change the windows was done before the current vendor. SO other works may have been done by former owners - how do we check that?

tomatoandcheese

If you Google Historic England search the list you should be able to find the original list description for the property. There's varying amounts of detail depending on when the building was listed but it might help to determine if other changes have been made

SG27

tomatoandcheese wrote: »

If you Google Historic England search the list you should be able to find the original list description for the property. There's varying amounts of detail depending on when the building was listed but it might help to determine if other changes have been made

Do this if things were altered that long ago and it its not specifically mentioned in the listing description then its very unlikely any would know and no chance of any enforement action.

If it were me I would maybe just get some advice from the converstaion officer regarding the window replacement cost and then knock the money off your offer.

rtho782

You're on the hook for unlimited costs to restore it in line with what the council decide is appropriate.

We used to rent a listed building, we loved it, it had so much character, despite a few niggles.

But I would never even consider buying one.

When we lived there, the LL got the outside of the house painted, whereupon it was discovered that it had at some point been fixed up with non-lime mortar, it cost her thousands upon thousands to have lime mortar repairs done. It took weeks.

Wasn't too disruptive to us because it was outside, but I wouldn't fancy the bill!

SG27

rtho782 wrote: »

You're on the hook for unlimited costs to restore it in line with what the council decide is appropriate.

We used to rent a listed building, we loved it, it had so much character, despite a few niggles.

But I would never even consider buying one.

When we lived there, the LL got the outside of the house painted, whereupon it was discovered that it had at some point been fixed up with non-lime mortar, it cost her thousands upon thousands to have lime mortar repairs done. It took weeks.

Wasn't too disruptive to us because it was outside, but I wouldn't fancy the bill!

That can happen with any house. You start some work and uncover bodging by previous owners.

redhead123

SG27 wrote: »

Do this if things were altered that long ago and it its not specifically mentioned in the listing description then its very unlikely any would know and no chance of any enforement action.

If it were me I would maybe just get some advice from the converstaion officer regarding the window replacement cost and then knock the money off your offer.

The problem is the council now know and they are going round to look! The vendor is going to be furious - I also asked her about maintenance and the reply was all old houses need maintenance ... but it looks Ike the windows have just had patch up jobs and one is completely rotted almost. Re the Upvc The conservation officer said they may not even ask them to change it. The house is lovely but after hearing what everyone has said on here I wonder if it's too high a risk.( the vendor may not want to sell to us now lol!!) A lot of houses on that road are listed because of the conservation area. A house in my road has come on we wondered whether to look at that but it's on with the same EA and they might not be impressed... the vendor posted on FB about it

rtho782

SG27 wrote: »

That can happen with any house. You start some work and uncover bodging by previous owners.

Not quite.

I bought my current house for £230k, the rebuild cost is £160k, the whole place could burn down and I could rebuild it for £160k.

Now let's say it's a Grade 2 listed. It burns down. I need to rebuild it exactly how it was, with specially sourced authentic materials from the 1500s, and expert craftsmen for lost trades, with a period appropriate thatched roof.

It might cost £1.2million, and would still only be worth £230k when done. And I can't just go "oh well, it's not worth it, I will just sell the land for £50k to a developer", it has to be done. If I can't afford it, I go bankrupt.

SG27

rtho782 wrote: »

Not quite.

I bought my current house for £230k, the rebuild cost is £160k, the whole place could burn down and I could rebuild it for £160k.

Now let's say it's a Grade 2 listed. It burns down. I need to rebuild it exactly how it was, with specially sourced authentic materials from the 1500s, and expert craftsmen for lost trades, with a period appropriate thatched roof.

It might cost £1.2million, and would still only be worth £230k when done. And I can't just go "oh well, it's not worth it, I will just sell the land for £50k to a developer", it has to be done. If I can't afford it, I go bankrupt.

Thats not true. An owner of a listed building isn’t required to rebuild a property following its total destruction. Listing exists to protect the special architectural or historic interest of a building something that wont be found in a replica of the original.

Obvously insurance is more expensive to account for the increased cost of repairs should the property be damaged and need to be restored.