Solicitor Letter Response?

BathCarOwner

Hello,

I’m in the same situation as many and have read the NEWBIES thread. However, the alleged parking contravention in my case was 10 months ago, and I have come to this forum late, having been advised to ignore all communication from the various agencies to date. I have just received an initial letter from Galdstones solicitors and am seeking advice on an appropriate response. Hopefully someone can help. I detail the sequence of letters below –


Parking charge date: 18.06.2016
Issued by: Park Watch Ltd

*** Note: I received no window sticker and no Parking Charge Notice by post ***

The first I knew of this alleged contravention was -


LETTER 1: 16.08.16

From: Debt Recovery Plus (Collections Manager)
Subject: Demand for Payment - £149

It refers to an original letter that I never received. Goes on to say they used a ‘tracing facility’ to provide ‘the above new address as your most current address’ and send this letter (Letter 1) to me.

Action: Ignored


LETTER 2: 31.08.16

From: Debt Recovery Plus (Litigation Manager)
Subject: Notice of intended court action – unpaid parking charge £149

Urges me to make contact urgently ‘in light of the landmark court ruling Beavis v Parking Eye Ltd’

Action: Ignored


LETTER 3: 15.09.16

From: Debt Recovery Plus (Litigation Manager)
Subject: Reduced Payment Offer –£126.65 – to avoid court action

Action: Ignored


LETTER 4: 03.10.16

From: Zenith Collections (Litigation Manager)
Subject: Reduced Payment Offer –£80 – to avoid expense of court action

‘Please accept this letter as official notification that Zenith Collections are now responsible for the recovery of this debt. As of the date of this letter, all communication and payments … should be made to ourselves.’

Action: Ignored


LETTER 5: 30.03.17 (6 months later)

From: Gladstones Solicitors
Claimant: Defence Systems Limited T/A Park Watch
Amount: £149

‘Our client MAY now instruct us to take legal action against you.’
Invites me to make payment to DRP (contradicts the above advice in Letter 4 from Zenith Collections).
Threatens that the debt is likely to increase with ‘potential enforcement action’.
Costs ‘may increase if the claim is defended.’

Action: ?

Would be grateful for any advice.

Loadsofchildren123

This is not a Letter Before Claim, it's just another debt collector's letter (even though it has the Gladstones letterhead).


Ignore it.


When you do get a Letter Before Claim (this will be labelled as a LBC and will refer to the Practice Direction - Pre-Action Conduct and Protocols and it will ask for a response within 14 days) you should respond to it. The letter will provide barely any information - respond by asking for the following information:
1. what the cause of action is
2. whether they are pursuing you as driver or keeper
3. whether they are relying on the provisions of Schedule 4 of POFA 2012
4. what the details of the claim are (where it is claimed the car was parked, for how long and how the monies being claimed arose)
5. a copy of the contract with the landowner
6. a copy of any alleged contract with the driver
7. a plan showing where any signs were displayed
8. details of the signs displayed (size of sign, size of font, height at which displayed)
9. If they have added anything on to the original charge, ask them what that represents and how it has been calculated.


Tell them that you are entitled to this information under paragraphs 6(a) and 6(c) of the Practice Direction, and you need it to comply with your own obligations under paragraph 6(b).


Warn them that if they do not provide this information then you will be relying on the cases of Webb Resolutions Ltd v Waller Needham & Green [2012] EWHC 3529 (Ch), Daejan Investments Limited v The Park West Club Limited (Part 20) – Buxton Associates [2003] EWHC 2872, Charles Church Developments Ltd v Stent Foundations Limited & Peter Dann Limited [2007] EWHC 855.

End by saying that until they provide this information/evidence then you cannot respond to the alleged claim or consider your position, and in those circumstances it is entirely premature to issue proceedings and if they do so then you will seek an immediate stay pursuant to paragraph 15(b) of the Practice Direction and an order that this information is provided.


These cases are all authority for how the court should punish a party who fails to comply with the Practice Direction.


Don't expect this to necessarily work. They always ignore the practice direction - but quoting this case law may make a difference. And you are protecting yourself on costs later by writing this letter and putting them on notice early on that you want this information and cannot respond to the claim properly without it.

Murlton

If the reference number starts with 3 and the payment is directed to DRP its apparantly still DRP sending the letters, just using Gladstone Solicitors paper.

Murlton

Loadsofchildren123 wrote: »

This is not a Letter Before Claim, it's just another debt collector's letter (even though it has the Gladstones letterhead).


Ignore it.


When you do get a Letter Before Claim (this will be labelled as a LBC and will refer to the Practice Direction - Pre-Action Conduct and Protocols and it will ask for a response within 14 days) you should respond to it. The letter will provide barely any information - respond by asking for the following information:
1. what the cause of action is
2. whether they are pursuing you as driver or keeper
3. whether they are relying on the provisions of Schedule 4 of POFA 2012
4. what the details of the claim are (where it is claimed the car was parked, for how long and how the monies being claimed arose)
5. a copy of the contract with the landowner
6. a copy of any alleged contract with the driver
7. a plan showing where any signs were displayed
8. details of the signs displayed (size of sign, size of font, height at which displayed)
9. If they have added anything on to the original charge, ask them what that represents and how it has been calculated.


Tell them that you are entitled to this information under paragraphs 6(a) and 6(c) of the Practice Direction, and you need it to comply with your own obligations under paragraph 6(b).


Warn them that if they do not provide this information then you will be relying on the cases of Webb Resolutions Ltd v Waller Needham & Green [2012] EWHC 3529 (Ch), Daejan Investments Limited v The Park West Club Limited (Part 20) – Buxton Associates [2003] EWHC 2872, Charles Church Developments Ltd v Stent Foundations Limited & Peter Dann Limited [2007] EWHC 855.

End by saying that until they provide this information/evidence then you cannot respond to the alleged claim or consider your position, and in those circumstances it is entirely premature to issue proceedings and if they do so then you will seek an immediate stay pursuant to paragraph 15(b) of the Practice Direction and an order that this information is provided.


These cases are all authority for how the court should punish a party who fails to comply with the Practice Direction.


Don't expect this to necessarily work. They always ignore the practice direction - but quoting this case law may make a difference. And you are protecting yourself on costs later by writing this letter and putting them on notice early on that you want this information and cannot respond to the claim properly without it.

Are you saying a LBCCC will be arriving at some point then? Or is there a chance it may never turn up.

BathCarOwner

Wow LoadsofChildren. Many thanks for such a prompt and detailed reply. I'll hold fire on responding for now and update this thread if/when an LBC is issued.

BathCarOwner

The reference is a seven digit number starting with a '2'.

Murlton

BathCarOwner wrote: »

The reference is a seven digit number starting with a '2'.

I'm only relaying information I received yesterday for my situation from Coupon-mad. If someone with more experience could maybe comment and clear this up?

Loadsofchildren123

Murlton wrote: »

I'm only relaying information I received yesterday for my situation from Coupon-mad. If someone with more experience could maybe comment and clear this up?

You are correct. Using the gladstones letterhead is a front designed to pressurise you into paying. Unless it's headed as a LBC it isn't a LBC.

Loadsofchildren123

Murlton wrote: »

Are you saying a LBCCC will be arriving at some point then? Or is there a chance it may never turn up.

It may never turn up. Although it's likely to. Some PPCs are less litigious than others. And even if they write one they may not proceed to issue anything.

Murlton

Loadsofchildren123 wrote: »

It may never turn up. Although it's likely to. Some PPCs are less litigious than others. And even if they write one they may not proceed to issue anything.

I'm going through this game at the minute too, I have just received a fake LBCCC and I have a post open about it in the forums. I was hoping it'd never get to the point where I need to actually put together a case and create an argument for court. However, the more I see the more I can't help but feel like it's inevitable!

A lot of the information and guidance on here points towards ignoring the letters at the right stage, i.e. after you've submitted an original appeal etc. Is that simply just to avoid paying the debt collectors and accept that one day you'll likely be in court? Or is it with the hope that they'll eventually just leave you alone?

Umkomaas

A lot of the information and guidance on here points towards ignoring the letters at the right stage, i.e. after you've submitted an original appeal etc. Is that simply just to avoid paying the debt collectors and accept that one day you'll likely be in court? Or is it with the hope that they'll eventually just leave you alone?

Any or all of the above.