I've got wood!

Gloomendoom

I've had success growing trees from cuttings. I've got quite a substantial oak tree grown from an acorn. It was planted when I was a teenager though.

Davesnave

grubbybumper wrote: »

The best I've come up with is is holly. All that is required to start a new tree is to stick a small branch in the ground. It grows fairly rapidly, and is very robust.

Compared with field maple, willow, ash cherry or varieties of poplar, holly is a real slouch, and I don't find it at all easy to root from cuttings.

Those are all things that make it expensive to buy, compared with the aforementioned, all easy from seed or cuttings. Mind you, I know a wood where there are hundreds of hollies, so they do self-seed in the right places.

I know willow is supposed to be rubbish to burn, but I find mine is perfectly OK if properly seasoned and there's a 100% success rate when it comes to rooting the things.

If only the sheep wouldn't eat them when they have headaches!

Greenfires

There are several online suppliers of tree seed who cover pretty much every species available. Prices vary a bit with how hard the seeds are to source (and they'll either collect themselves or know exactly where the seed originates) but the majority of species will set you back about 99p for the smallest packs of seeds - which even so tend to be around 20 - 30 seeds. Most tree seeds require a degree of pre treatment in the fridge - Holly out of interest is one of the trickiest to do from seed and you can be looking at up to 64 weeks from the start of the process to germination!
Have a look at http://www.treeseedonline.com/ and also at http://forestart.co.uk/ for what's available - and how cheap it can be!

Gloomendoom

Davesnave wrote: »

I know willow is supposed to be rubbish to burn, but I find mine is perfectly OK if properly seasoned and there's a 100% success rate when it comes to rooting the things.

If only the sheep wouldn't eat them when they have headaches!

I have burnt a lot of willow and it is fine although not very dense. I did season it for four years though.

A willow log will grow back into a tree if you leave it on the ground.

A._Badger

Agreed about willow - it's much maligned but if you can ever get it dry it burns reasonably well, albeit with a relatively low heat output.

grubbybumper

My advice is targeted at anyone who is thinking of buying a wood burner to SAVE MONEY over conventional heating. It can be done effectively, but isn't easy. If the advice helps just one person, it was worth posting this message.

The wood source needs to be freely available, with the emphasis on free, otherwise you would be better off using central heating. There has to be a sustainable plan as well, which probably means having a bit of land to grow the wood.

Being made of cast iron or similar, a stove is slow to heat up, and slow to cool down.The advantage of continuous use with a wood burner is the avoidance of large temperature fluctuations. It also means you never have to light it, and it can be used for warming the teapot or your plates.

If you are have little experience of wood stoves, to keep it in overnight requires as big a piece of seasoned wood as the stove will take, and once it is burning, close all the vents down completely. If you have chosen the right wood, the log will be happily smouldering in the morning, and by opening up the vents, it will be aflame in minutes.

As far as the choice of wood goes, the professional forum goers will all have their own opinions. A lot depends on where you live. If, like me, you live in an area where the weather is challenging, holly will serve you well. It's worth looking at what is growing in the hedgerows however. Any tree/bush which is slow growing will tend to be more dense, and therefore will burn longer. Holly will survive extremes of temperature. There is no need to bother about seeds, otherwise you will have a long wait for fuel for your stove. Propagating holly is very simple. Take a large piece of new growth and stick it in the ground. That's it.

It is happy with north/south/east or west facing. The soil can be sand, clay, chalk or loam. It is happy with most moisture levels, apart from water-logged. PH can be acid/alkaline or neutral.

To make life easy, encourage the holly to grow into a tree rather than a bush. This way you get a very useable trunk which can be cut according to the size of your stove. It is essential to allow the wood to dry out, which is a bare minimum of one year.

Anyone who truly uses wood for heat, will tell you that it heats you up twice. First when you cut it down, and secondly, when you burn it.

silverwhistle

I'd agree with grumpybumper. I have to admit to picking up the odd batch of briquettes when I'm going past the shop, but I burn them in conjunction with free wood. I'm in a large village with country near, but most of the stuff collected is suburban garden leavings (Leylandia, chestnut, apple etc.) and storm damage, a car load of oak from a friend and so on. My girlfriend has orders to collect some from a country estate which has been offered to us, but she's too busy at the moment.

I don't slumber my stove overnight but with a good bed of ash have often been able to revive it very quickly in the morning from the hidden embers. It hasn't really been a cold enough winter for that to be needed very often. My minuscule* gas bills tell that I have indeed saved money, though that's not why I got it.
*Actually a little more than last winter, and my next bill due in a couple of weeks will be for about 370kWh.

Davesnave

silverwhistle wrote: »

I'd agree with grumpybumper. .

I'm just confused by their statements.

At the start, we're told this is to "SAVE MONEY."

Then we hear: "The wood source needs to be freely available, with the emphasis on free, otherwise you would be better off using central heating. There has to be a sustainable plan as well, which probably means having a bit of land to grow the wood."

So, we have to have a free source of wood, which probably means having land in the longer term.

How many people have a few spare acres? In most parts of the UK, that means spending well in excess of £20k, just to get started. However, if that land is conveniently part of the place where one lives, that £20k could easily be much, much more.

This free wood is beginning to look rather expensive.

I don't deny land is a good long term investment, but it's not a very liquid asset, and of course it has to be sold to realise that investment potential.

That's fine, if you have plenty of money to start with, like the farmer next to me, who bought 17 acres of wood in 2009 and has now just sold half of it for the same price as he paid for the lot. Yes, his wood is now 'free,' but then he's probably had no problem paying his energy bills over the past 8 years, since he had the equivalent of £50k in today's money to invest.

As someone who struggled for years to get secure land to invest my time and energy in, I'd like to hear how this free wood growing works on an average budget.

grubbybumper

Hmmn. It's plain that these forums serve different people in different ways. I have to admire anyone that can write an average of 5 posts per day for the past 20 years.

I was looking to answer the following question:

If I buy a wood burning stove, will it save me money on my heating bills?

Hopefully a search engine will bring you here, in which case my answer is as follows:

Probably not, but it is achievable. In order to effect this, you need a plentiful supply of seasoned and sustainable wood, which in reality, probably means having some land and the ability to plant trees. This combination will only apply to a few people.

If you buy wood, you wont save money over conventional heating.

If you have moved into a house with a multi-fuel burner in situ, then hopefully, the initial (and not inconsiderable) financial outlay is avoided. If you have an open fireplace, and central heating, then purchasing a multi-fuel burner is a good idea, as the open fire will tend to extract the centrally heated air from the house.

Stating the obvious perhaps, the cost of whatever fuel you buy for a stove has to be balanced against the reduction in your normal heating bills.

There are plainly other benefits from a stove, such as a cosy feeling, and being visually attractive, which is why most people buy a stove, but if you are purely looking to save money, think twice.

I'm afraid I wont be able to answer any supplementary questions, as my reason for posting this was to give others the benefit of my experience, rather than to be self-serving.

Davesnave

grubbybumper wrote: »

Hmmn. It's plain that these forums serve different people in different ways. I have to admire anyone that can write an average of 5 posts per day for the past 20 years.
Me too. This site has only been in existence since around 2006, so it would be quite a feat. Don't knock heavy posters though; some are housebound or carers and that sort of thing. There are many reasons, including using the site an alternative to Faceache et al.
I was looking to answer the following question:

If I buy a wood burning stove, will it save me money on my heating bills?
But that wasn't the title of this thread.
Hopefully a search engine will bring you here, in which case my answer is as follows:
Unlikely. Search engines look at thread titles.

Probably not, but it is achievable. In order to effect this, you need a plentiful supply of seasoned and sustainable wood, which in reality, probably means having some land and the ability to plant trees. This combination will only apply to a few people.
Yes the fortunate few; hence my post. Land has always a good investment for those with surplus money.
If you buy wood, you wont save money over conventional heating.
That's been covered ad infinitum on this forum and the vast majority of us agree with you. You are preaching to the converted.
I'm afraid I wont be able to answer any supplementary questions, as my reason for posting this was to give others the benefit of my experience, rather than to be self-serving.

I think you misunderstand the nature of this site. If you join a discussion and have very firm ideas to impart, you must expect someone to take issue with some of them. It doesn't mean you are wrong or they are wrong either, just that there is something worth discussing.

Anyway, these are just a few of the threads which come up when your question is put into Google:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/3378856

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4814447

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/2750384

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/3296678