Electric cars

Car_54

NigeWick wrote: »

Diesel vehicles are starting to be banned from cities and I expect towns will follow suit. VW is starting to design and produce electric vehicles and in a few years it will be by the million and other makers will follow on as these machines become cheaper (without subsidies) than fossil burners. Evs cost less to maintain and when renewable electricity is far cheaper than coal, gas, diesel and nuclear it will just be a no brainer.

When do you imagine that will happen, and how will it be achieved?

AdrianC

neilmcl wrote: »

Really, name one city in the UK that currently bans diesel cars?

...or is even proposing it.

Four cities worldwide have said they're going to in 2025. Paris, Athens, Madrid, Mexico City. Athens is talking about banning ALL CARS from the centre.

How many of those cities do you drive into the centre of?

facade

Car_54 wrote: »

When do you imagine that will happen, and how will it be achieved?

When we can get PVs upto above 50% efficient, and make them out of something that Chinese children can produce for around £1 a square metre, with an operational lifespan with zero maintainance of 30 years.

Never would be my guess, but you don't know...;)

Watched that series about generating electricity at a profit last year. I hadn't realised that it costs millions of pounds a year to keep a wind farm operational, an offshore one costs squillions, as they have to go there by helicopter, and they cost thousands an hour to run, even when they don't crash.

iolanthe07

Martyn1981 wrote: »

Both the Tesla 3 and the Chevy Bolt are 200bhp 200 mile range cars that will cost about $30k in the states, though there are no plans to build a RHD version of the Bolt.

Car and Driver got 190 miles out of the Bolt driving on freeways at 75mph.

Isn't it the Chevvy Volt?

agrinnall

iolanthe07 wrote: »

Isn't it the Chevvy Volt?

Rather confusingly they seem to have both a Bolt and a Volt.

http://www.chevrolet.com/bolt-ev-electric-vehicle.html

http://www.chevrolet.com/volt-electric-car.html

Martyn1981

when renewable electricity is far cheaper than coal, gas, diesel and nuclear

Car_54 wrote: »

When do you imagine that will happen, and how will it be achieved?

We are already there. Including the externality costs of pollution and CO2, then renewables are already cheaper than coal and gas.

Obviously diesel is far more expensive again than coal and gas generation.

Onshore wind and PV contracts issued in early 2015 are £83/MWh, compared to new nuclear (Hinkley Point C) at £102/MWh. More recent capacity auctions for wind in Italy and PV in Germany are £60/MWh reflecting the reduction in costs in the last 2 years.

Offshore wind contracts are slightly more than nuclear at £120/MWh, but they have fallen significantly from £155/MWh a few years ago, and are expected to be close to £100 soon (possibly in the Apr auctions), then fall to £85/MWh by the early/mid 2020's.

The proposed Swansea tidal scheme is expected to be around £100/MWh as a first of a kind, however the 10x larger Cardiff scheme is costed at onshore wind/PV costs, as is the whole 12 lagoon package.

So looks like they are already cheaper "than coal, gas, diesel and nuclear".

Obviously electricity is far cheaper than petrol/diesel for transport as 1kWh should take you about 3 miles, so £5/gallon of petrol, would buy you around 40kWh (or perhaps 70kWh on E7) and transport you around 120 miles.

Also about 50% of our electricity is now low carbon, and powerstations generate energy far more efficiently and cleanly than an ICE.

Martyn1981

iolanthe07 wrote: »

Isn't it the Chevvy Volt?

Hiya, the Volt is the hybrid car, sold as the Ampera in the UK.

The Bolt is the EV.

almillar

I just don't trust myself to a Renault although the range is adequate but it takes longer to charge

Renault Zoe can charge at 43kW (the rapid charging one). Leaf can do 50kW DC. Zoe can also do 22kW AC, 7kW Ac, 3kW AC, and if you buy a 'granny cable', 3 pin. Leaf can do 3kW AC, or 6kW AC optionally. Zoe doesn't slow down charging as much when the battery is full.
I would therefore say that it depends where you are, what speed they'll charge at. A 41kWh Zoe will take longer to charge than a 30 kWh Leaf, of course, but then it take in more energy, and goes further.
I don't see Leaf really having a speed advantage, unless you're counting the very specific 50kW DC vs 43 KW AC up to 80%. Many reasons to buy a Leaf over a Zoe, charging speed isn't one of them, unless you're surrounded by DC rapid chargers and no AC ones.

AdrianC

Martyn1981 wrote: »

Hiya, the Volt is the hybrid car, sold as the Ampera in the UK.

The Bolt is the EV.

To be sold in Europe as the Opel Ampera-e, just to confuse matters even further.

RHemmings

AdrianC wrote: »

To be sold in Europe as the Opel Ampera-e, just to confuse matters even further.

But not in the UK