Urgent Help needed Fiat/Peugeot water problem

Conor_3

carolannjo wrote: »

Hello and thanks for your contribution. Nice of you to respond so positively unlike the previous poster who although made a few valid points completely misunderstood the problem.

All I've read is that people are whinging because an iron engine and steel parts of components are going rusty because they're exposed to air as basic Chemistry 1.01 would show.

Water running off the windscreen area runs down a run off channel on the bulkhead as it's designed to do instead of running down the inner wings and getting in box sections where it'll sit and rot the body away. Some of it occassionally sits around the injectors (which wont cause any problem) and the nuts holding the injectors in are going rusty because the vehicle sits there for weeks on end not being run which would have evaporated the water.

To sum up then, the water goes down the route it's designed to and because the complainers don't use their vehicle from one week to the next so moisture isn't being burned off, some of the nuts are getting a bit of surface rust on them - all of which causes absolutely no problems whatsoever.

So in short, people are whinging about something which happens on most cars that don't get used on a daily basis but you don't get to see it nowadays on modern ones because the manufacturers put a shiny plastic cover over the top of the engine so you don't see it.

Explain it to me then if I'm not right.

carolannjo

No real need to explain as you have done it for me! Your description is EXACTLY what does not happen in our vans.
The previous incarnations of these vans do not have this problem, my 2005 model did not suffer from this. It is only the new 2007 models which do as they have a completely new design. The manufacturers recognise there is a problem but are slow to fix. Apparently because they have to design, test and then put into production the modification. This is being rolled out to vans currently in production then they will address vans already out there.
Pretty sure they wouldn't bother if what is happening was normal as you seem to imply.
To sum up you are wrong, you will always be wrong about this problem but keep posting it keeps this thread at the top and further helps us........so TA!!

Conor_3

carolannjo wrote: »

To sum up you are wrong, you will always be wrong about this problem but keep posting it keeps this thread at the top and further helps us........so TA!!

I asked you to explain it to me if I'm not right. Obviously I must be because you haven't.

I read every post on the forums linked at the top and that's the same thing every person is complaining about.

So where am I wrong or are you going to accept I'm right and shut the hell up?

And yes, the engine design has probably changed because they were noted for warping cylinder heads when they used aluminium.

1happy

Conor wrote: »

It's affecting coachbuilts. That's a Fiat that's had a special body built by a company. You're shouting at the wrong people. It should be the coachbuilders you're complaining to.

1.You quite clearly haven't read every post or you wouldn't have made the error in your 1st response of stating we were "shouting at the wrong people" when its nothing to do with the conversion!.

Conor wrote: »

I asked you to explain it to me if I'm not right. Obviously I must be because you haven't.
I read every post on the forums linked at the top and that's the same thing every person is complaining about.
So where am I wrong or are you going to accept I'm right and shut the hell up?
And yes, the engine design has probably changed because they were noted for warping cylinder heads when they used aluminium.

2.I can't decide if you are deliberately provocative or just misguided.
But in either event you might want to watch your language it doesn't fit with someone who purports to know so much!.
I don't believe demanding an answer to every question you raise & abusive statements if you dont get an answer is adult like.
In conclusion thanks for bumping the thread with your questionable responses & lord only knows what your motives for going OTT are!.
finally please restrict your outbursts to civil ones,
but like carolannjo, I too will not be interested in pacifying you and shan't respond, we know what we know and you can move on to your next thrill.
Bye bye

Motorhomer_2

Having worked on diesel engines from a single cylinder donkey pump up to a Rolls Royce V12 1000 HP Tank engine via Ford, Perkins, BMC and Volvo engines and as someone who has bought a new Peugeot based motorhome, I have every sympathy with the various postings.

Let me explain, the Peugeot cylinder head is aluminium, the injectors are a high grade steel. There is a plastic cover which is very close to the aluminium cylinder head. The design of this cover is such that it traps a pool of water approx 5 mm deep and the water cannot seem to drain away. When the engine is cold and it is raining, water pours onto the cover and can lie there for weeks as Motorhomes are often not used for some periods of time.

1st concern is that I believe that the rusting of the steel injectors and the associated corrosion of the aluminium head will be such that it may be problematic in removing the injectors. A further concern is the possibly of corrosion debris dropping into the engine once the copper gasket has been broken.

2nd There is a hole in the scuttle directly above the fuse box and I have watched water drain directly onto this area.

3rd Peugeot have track record of leaking vans, one of the previous versions of the present Boxer leaked water and this ended up causing both mechanical and electrical problems.

webhamster

ITs a genuine fault , its recognised but as a poster has said manufacturers have been slow to rectify ... both the oem and the retrofitter (coach built rebadger).

theres video out there , on you tube i think , to show it happening.

Another thing which is related but not the same fault on the x250 and not all of them. I just returned one to manufacturer and retailer , its not been used for 6 months so I have lost the whole season , they were too slow for me in repsonding so went the legal route from the 2nd month of wating.6 months lost abroad that was planned for years.

The fault I had was that the door , the exit on from the hab space vents , it was sucking up diesel fumes and triggering the smoke detector above it , every 10 mins i had to wind down the driver window to get shot of the fumes it made three occupants ill.Summarily it left residue all over the hab space.The exhaust is poorly designed and is too near not only these vents but also the open window of both driver and passenger depending on layout.Another point is that after 50mph the front doors are drafty with air force opening them at the seal top on low profs.

edit , its mentioned on the forum of motorhomefacts.com not utube as mentioned

Conor_3

Motorhomer wrote: »

Having worked on diesel engines from a single cylinder donkey pump up to a Rolls Royce V12 1000 HP Tank engine via Ford, Perkins, BMC and Volvo engines and as someone who has bought a new Peugeot based motorhome, I have every sympathy with the various postings.

Let me explain, the Peugeot cylinder head is aluminium, the injectors are a high grade steel. There is a plastic cover which is very close to the aluminium cylinder head. The design of this cover is such that it traps a pool of water approx 5 mm deep and the water cannot seem to drain away. When the engine is cold and it is raining, water pours onto the cover and can lie there for weeks as Motorhomes are often not used for some periods of time.

1st concern is that I believe that the rusting of the steel injectors and the associated corrosion of the aluminium head will be such that it may be problematic in removing the injectors. A further concern is the possibly of corrosion debris dropping into the engine once the copper gasket has been broken.

2nd There is a hole in the scuttle directly above the fuse box and I have watched water drain directly onto this area.

3rd Peugeot have track record of leaking vans, one of the previous versions of the present Boxer leaked water and this ended up causing both mechanical and electrical problems.

THANKYOU. At last....

So, as a Time Served mechanic holding a CGLI 383 PT2....

1) Completely unfounded. They'd corrode anyway regardless of water being there. They all do. It is also unlikely that the injectors would be needed to be removed for any reason for several years anyway - certainly at a point where vehicles without this "fault" would now have injector retaining bolts just as rusty regardless of mileage done. The same applies for the claim of debris falling into the engine.

2) This is the only actual real complaint TBH.

1happy

Hi Conor,
Having played "thread tennis" with you it is now clear why you have such strong opinions on this subject!

You are a Mechanic!

One of the very people who look at our hard earned and paid for vehicles and give us the benefit of your knowledge with little or no compassion!

There were however two points to carolannjo's original posting & along with "bumping" the thread, you demonstrate quite nicely with your beligerent attitude what we are up against even trying to get answers to our concerns (regardless of the rights and wrongs of them!)

The first part will obviously never be answered to your superior knowledge satisfaction...so I give in.

The second part of carolannjo's posting asks for people to sign a petition stating:-

PLEASE PLEASE SIGN OUR PETITION TO DEMONSTRATE THAT IT IS UNFAIR OF LARGE CORPORATIONS TO TREAT THIER CUSTOMERS THIS WAY!IGN OUR PETITION TO DEMONSTRATE THAT IT IS UNFAIR OF LARGE CORPORATIONS TO TREAT THIER CUSTOMERS THIS WAY!

LINK HERE>> http://www.petition.co.uk/water_ingress_to_engine_re_fiat__peugeot

Thankyou for demonstrating the single minded indifference that we face.

PS Didn't you once state you were a bankrupt?
I only ask because this would also explain your thinking that we should all just walk away from our percieved problems!
I await your hopefully non colourfull reply!:money:

1happy

Hi Conor.
No reply?
I won't scream and shout like you did!
But I will take your silence to mean you have found a new place to be argumentative!
It was interesting blah blah blah
For all the genuine consumer concerned citizens
Please sign our petition.



LINK HERE>> http://www.petition.co.uk/water_ingr..._fiat__peugeot

Motorhomer_2

Connor, I am at a loss to understand your hostility and abrasive nature and up until a few minutes ago. I felt that you had a personal vendetta against Motorhome drivers. That was until I found your Nemesis, namely http://newsgroups.derkeiler.com where you met your match and were shot down in flames by a gentleman by the name of Mike. The exact link to that epsiode was http://newsgroups.derkeiler.com/Archive/Uk/uk.rec.driving/2006-03/msg02021.html

As I understand it, the topic related to double declutching and in one of your more provocative postings your trundled out your tired old City and Guilds 383 PT 2 in the Repair and Servicing of Road Vehicles and then stated that with reference to syncromesh units " I DO KNOW HOW THEY WORK.

Mike replied

No. You do not. It is quite obvious from your posts, and despite your
impressive sounding qualifications that you don't have a clue of how they
work, otherwise you would not be spouting so much ignorant rubbish.
You really should avoid technical arguments about engineering, because you
have a history of always coming unstuck when it comes down to details.

Mike.

Connor, can I just add that I have just taken the cover of my Peugeot 406 with 160,000 miles on the clock and the injectors are just dirty, not covered in rust like my new Boxer with just 3000 miles. As Mike said you just seem to jump in and then show your total ignorence of the subject.

Bye, and have a nice day!