Insurance Payout - Help!!!

chi-chi

Anyone got any advice? Someone pranged my car and dented the back door. My car, (Vauxhall Cavalier, K reg) has been written off by the insurance company. It cost me £600 just over a year ago and mechanically is in tidy condition - it runs great. I have spent a fair bit of money on it and it has 8 month's MOT. It is (was) a nice car.

The insurers have valued it at £455, breaking it down to £75 salvage to be retained by me, and £380 from the insurance company. They state that this can ONLY be challenged by a "full engineer's report". That would be too expensive to be worthwhile.

The mechanic who looks after my car says she thinks by law they have to make another offer but is unsure. I intend to gather bills, service history etc together and find prices of comparable cars.

Has anyone got any further advice? I would like to change my car - there are other, non-mechanical things going wrong, (eg small crack in windscreen) so don't object to writing it off, however it seems unfair that I will be out of pocket when someone else was at fault. I realise this is commonplace with insurance write offs but think it's worth challenging their decision and would appreciate advice.

Thanks!

MarkyMarkD

If the accident was not your fault (which it sounds like it wasn't) and the other party haven't done a runner, you can require them or their insurers to pay for the damage to be repaired.

Their insurers can't write off your car. Your insurers may suggest they are writing it off, but you can insist on them pursuing the third party for the repair costs.

If your insurers are being completely useless, ignore them and contact the other party (or their insurers) directly along with the quotes for the repair. If they continue to take the p*** then take them to small claims court.

I am not that surprised that they are writing it off - can't you get it repaired for a few £00 using a replacement door from a scrap yard which will just require a quick respray? If that was the case I might be tempted to accept the £380 settlement and get it repaired out of that amount.

Bossyboots

MarkyMarkD wrote:

If the accident was not your fault (which it sounds like it wasn't) and the other party haven't done a runner, you can require them or their insurers to pay for the damage to be repaired.

Their insurers can't write off your car. Your insurers may suggest they are writing it off, but you can insist on them pursuing the third party for the repair costs.

If your insurers are being completely useless, ignore them and contact the other party (or their insurers) directly along with the quotes for the repair. If they continue to take the p*** then take them to small claims court.

I am not that surprised that they are writing it off - can't you get it repaired for a few £00 using a replacement door from a scrap yard which will just require a quick respray? If that was the case I might be tempted to accept the £380 settlement and get it repaired out of that amount.

The insurers can write off the car. That is a clause int he T&Cs of insurance policies.

Once a car is written off, the insurance company notifies DVLA. I am surprised the OP is being allowed to keep the scrap. My hubby battled to be allowed to have his motorbike back, we even had a buyer for it, but they would not let him have it.

Some info here http://www.direct.gov.uk/Topics/Motoring/OwningAVehicle/ChangingYourDetails/ChangingYourDetailsArticle/fs/en?CONTENT_ID=4022057&chk=yg35/n

telly-addict

Agree with Bossy Boots that your insurers are within their rights to write off your vehicle - a standard policy term. You certainly have the option to argue the toss over the amount offered. You're doing the right thing in putting together your own evidence on value - take a look at other threads on this page for some ideas - Parkers, local papers, etc. Your insurers can't insist on a full engineer's report - ask them to quote the policy wording that supports this stance.

While the at fault third party (or insurers) is responsible for putting you back in the same position as before the accident (the principle of indemnity), a Court is very unlikely to insist on repairs being done to you vehicle that cost far in excess of the write off value. It probably isn't worth the time and expense in following this route.

It should be quicker to settle with you own insurers and for them to pursue the third party insurers for their outlay. In reality you will probably get an even more hard-nosed approach (and a lower settlement offer) from the third party insurers.

It's always worth haggling. Just get yourself fully prepared.

Good luck.

wolftastic_2

Try this outfit Midland Claims Recovery they are highly recommended.

MarkyMarkD

Bossy and telly

I think you are ignoring the main part of my point, which is that it's nothing to do with your insurers if you have a third party accident and wish the third party to indemnify you for the damage caused to your car. That is between you and the third party - and the third party insurer CANNOT write-off your car.

Of course if you have a blameworthy accident, your insurer CAN write off your car and pay you a fair value for it. But that is not the situation here. Your insurer can ALSO write off your car if you claim from them under your comprehensive policy and leave them to claim back their losses from the third party's insurers. But the third party insurers themselves can't write off your car.

And "time and expense" in following this route? Small claims court costs next to nothing.

maclean2

Hi - if you decide to accept the write off then make sure you claim for the following from the other guy's insurance company -

your policy excess
phone calls stamps and miscellaneous costs - ask for £25.00
"loss of use" - if the car could not safely or legally be used or driven ask for £70.00 per week from the date of the accident until you received the cheque and had had time to bank it ( if the door would not open then argue that the car was not safe to use and this is a strong argument if you often have rear seat passengers)


Best of luck

telly-addict

MarkyMarkD wrote:

Bossy and telly

I think you are ignoring the main part of my point, which is that it's nothing to do with your insurers if you have a third party accident and wish the third party to indemnify you for the damage caused to your car. That is between you and the third party - and the third party insurer CANNOT write-off your car.

Of course if you have a blameworthy accident, your insurer CAN write off your car and pay you a fair value for it. But that is not the situation here. Your insurer can ALSO write off your car if you claim from them under your comprehensive policy and leave them to claim back their losses from the third party's insurers. But the third party insurers themselves can't write off your car.

And "time and expense" in following this route? Small claims court costs next to nothing.

I'm not sure that I agree with either point, I'm afraid.

Indemnity simply means putting the third party back into the same poistion as pre-accident. However, this does not necessarily mean repairing the vehicle - it can also take the form of an appropriate level of financial compensation. In this case, the pre-accident value of the vehicle would be a suitable indemnity.

Take the example of a car worth only £250. It's involved in a no-fault accident, with repairs to the vehicle estimated at £3,000. Repairing the vehicle would not be an appropriate measure of indemnity - the pre-accident value would be an appropriate measure.

Turning to your comments about the small claims court, the process can be pretty time-consuming. If the action is defended, it may include an attendance at a small claims hearing. It can take months to resolve. As well as the miscellaneous costs, there is always the matter of the issue fee - something like £50 when claiming about £500?

More details can be found from the following link:
http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/index/your_rights/legal_system/small_claims/index/your_rights/legal_system/small_claims.htm

Still maintain that you're better off claiming from your comprehensive insurance and then pursuing the third party insurers in tandem with your insurers for your uninsured losses (as detailed by mclean2) and your insurer's outlay.

MarkyMarkD

I understand what you are saying, here, telly.

But (a) a third party insurer's assessment of the market value of a car they want to write off isn't necessarily the indemnity value. A car can be worth more to the person who owns it than its nominal market value.

Clearly in extreme cases like the example you mention, it's not reasonable to expect £3,000. But where the difference between perceived value and "market" value is a few £00, I do think it's reasonable.

And (b) the issue fee doesn't matter as it's recoverable as part of the claim on a successful claim. I don't honestly believe an insurer is going to defend a claim for £200 (if that's the amount) and even if it's somewhat more, I think they might be tempted to make a more sensible offer rather than go to court.

Maclean is of course right about "sundry" costs - excess (of course), and the other elements. And that is a responsibility of your uninsured loss insurers to recover.

telly-addict

Marky Mark, I can understand your point of view and in some ways agree with the sentiment, but from my own experience of dealing with claims for many years:

(a) In reality, indemnity is set by what a court would award - this has to be (and is) a financial value based on pre-accident value (PAV) , not a notional or hypothetical "worth" to the individual.

(b) Yes, the issue fee and certain limited additional costs are recoverable if successful, but you still have to pay the issue fee up front and then wait months to recover. Of course, insurance companies do prefer to settle without the need for a court hearing, but where a reasonable PAV offer has been made most prudent insurers will (or should) stick to their guns.

Interesting debate though.

Bossyboots

Sorry to hijack this but I didn't want to start another one along the same lines.

This morning someone ran into the back of my car. There is quite a lot of damage although it is driveable. I could go through my insurers who have indicated they believe it would be a write off and we would agree.

However, the other girl's insurers have just telephoned me to say that they admit liability. I described the damage to her and she said it sounded like a write off. They are offering to agree a settlement although when she checked the book price, it was high enough value to say she would send an engineer. The price they are considering is nearly 3x what we thought it was worth. They have said though that if we do that, we can keep the car. I am not sure what we would have to do then. Although it is driveable it is a bit of a mess and you cannot open the boot. I would not plan to drive it and I am sure there must be DVLA implications if it is written off.

Can anyone give me some thoughts. In particular I note that MarkyD says they cannot write the car off so I am wondering about just insisting they repair it. My OH though had been on at me to change my car as he would like me to have one with air bags. I am short in height and would be quite badly injured in a head on crash as the steering wheel is so close to my stomach. I had also considered just getting rid of the car anyway. I don't want to be stuck with a heap that I cannot get rid of.