Family Dilema over Parents future welfare

ElsieMonkey

missbiggles1 wrote: »

Why on earth would the parents want to give their money away now, just when they're needing to look towards paying for help with their care or even care home fees?

Who knows, but they are, they're giving it ALL away for the brother to build an extension!

They don't HAVE to give anything away now, but just know how they would give it away when the time comes, but in the meantime keep it in their own bank account in case it's needed. I did say that the parents should keep money to themselves anyway!

accoustic22

They most definately need better living space so it will require some work doing, although it seems a lot more complex than we even imagined. But the extension we feel does need to be re-thought and the rest of the money kept for their future needs.

Thank you everyone for your all your input, it has most definately given us some valid points to discuss. Obviously any more comments or pointers not already mentioned would be most welcome.
Thanks again.

Kynthia

I don't disagree with the above comments and think there are lots of downsides, risks and possible outcomes no-one researched or discussed before going ahead with this plan. However the brother was willing to have his elderly parents live with him and his family, something many would rather not do, and may have every intention of doing the right thing. So i don't think we can assume he has manipulated things, is out to gain from his parents and take his siblings inheritance, or is generally a bad person. He might be or he might not be, but relying on his intentions and having no plans in place for divorce, inheritance tax, care home fees, sharing the inheritance, etc is not good.

London_Town

accoustic22 wrote: »

Thanks missbiggles1, no he doesn't have power of attorney, not that we have been made aware of anyway - he just has access to their money and cards for food and such like fuel for the car to run them around to doctors, hospital etc - that what we understand it to be anyway.

This is potentially so dodgy, as it sounds like your brother knows pin numbers but is acting without power of attorney. There may be plenty of adult children that do this with total integrity, but there are also those that don't.

As has already been said, this is awful as it appears there are no legal agreements or documents about anything that has happened so far. However, all you can do is take things forward from this point.

If it were my parents, I'd want to get power of attorney in place, so all three siblings could see the situation managed properly. This is much easier to put in place when at least one parent is still sound of mind. Your brother may be acting in good faith, or he may be trying use your parents money to his advantage and disinherit you at the same time.

I would be speaking to both the parents and the the siblings to ensure that everything becomes transparent and fair - for all parties involved.

AnotherJoe

Have a word with your mum.
She needs the money for care for her and husband.
Extension an irrelevance now.

You need to persuade her of this otherwise as said, you're screwed and neither her or her husband, your sister or you will see that money.

accoustic22

Thanks Kynthia. This is very true and indeed its not something we could offer our parents so it seemed like an ideal solution at first but hings have changed since then and the thing with the 15yrs on the mortgage was only thrown in the mix just now and not a year ago when first discussed and agreed by us all. Ultimately, my parents money should be used to serve them the best way possibly and if that means theres no inheritance money then we are completely fine with that.

moneyistooshorttomention

AnotherJoe wrote: »

Have a word with your mum.
She needs the money for care for her and husband.
Extension an irrelevance now.

You need to persuade her of this otherwise as said, you're screwed and neither her or her husband, your sister or you will see that money.

This is very much how it's sounding to me too I'm afraid.

I've got very distinct alarm bells going off - for both the parents, OP and other sibling.

I may be being an old cynic - but, one way or another, I do fear that if the parents give Bro the money to put into his house that he won't see it as them "investing" it in his property and know he is under an obligation to sell it later on (ie for the sake of the inheritance of OP and other sister). He's already proven bad with money - ie that re-mortgaging he has already done.

The parents' money is needed, first and foremost, for themselves in case of any care costs (and it sounds as if there will be some) and to make sure the parents don't fall foul of the "deprivation of assets" rule that applies.

If their house has now gone - then it would be best for everyone (except Bro:cool::)) for their money to be invested (but properly - and NOT in Bro's house). They, in turn, pay a fair share of running costs of Bro's house (ie if they only have one room - which is what it sounds like to me) then, in Bro's position I would only expect from them:
- the extra costs of water, fuel, on the phonebill, that type of thing because they were there.

Even though personally my parents charged me more than one persons' extra costs when I lived with them many years ago - to me I wouldnt do that. I don't believe it's correct to charge "rent" either way within immediate family - just the extra costs of having 1 (2 in their case) extra people living there and leave it at that. It's not appropriate to profit from parents imo by charging rent.

Basically - parents' money MUST be protected from Bro helping himself to it (whether it's deliberately or more accidentally). Bro does sound like the type of person who is basically making a mess of his own personal finances - and therefore all too likely to start "borrowing" from the parents money (maybe even with every genuine intention of paying it back initially - but somehow it never happens:cool:). We have read some very sad tales of this sort of thing on MSE.

"Ringfencing" is the word I'm talking around here. The parents' money needs "ringfencing" for the sake of their safety and, to first and foremost ensure they have what they need from their own money - and, latterly, not having Bro grabbing any inheritance that gets left solely into his own bank account (and blow OP and the other sister).

teddysmum

I wonder how things actually work out when people needing care and should be able to fund it , but have either given the money away or been deprived of it.


Their assets are assessed as still including that money, but they don't have it.


Does the LA leave them to suffer or are they funded anyway and those benefiting from the money allowed to get away with it.


You hear about the rules, but not the result of their application.

Cakeguts

First thing about this is that Dad is going to have to go into residential care. People with dementia have to be watched 24 hours a day otherwise they can wander off. How is your brother going to cope with an adult who can't dress himself, can't wash or shave himself, may be doubly incontinent, and can easily wander off and get lost?

Depending on how ill Mun is it might not be long before she needs nursing care as well. Their money that came from the sale of their house is their money and it is now going to be needed to fund somewhere for them to live where they can have the level of nursing care they need.

There is no longer a need for the extension. There is a need for the money that belongs to your parents to be returned to them and for someone to find a nursing home for Dad.

BritishBibliophile

accoustic22 wrote: »

Thanks missbiggles1, no he doesn't have power of attorney, not that we have been made aware of anyway - he just has access to their money and cards for food and such like fuel for the car to run them around to doctors, hospital etc - that what we understand it to be anyway.

You need to sort out power of attorney and you need to do it soon. Get it for both your parents and insist that both you and your brother hold it. Tell your brother that you feel it would be best in case he's on holiday or otherwise uncontactable in the event of an emergency, in reality though you should do it just so you can act as a balance if necessary.

Please do not wait until things get worse before you sort this out, POA is so important and having it will make things a lot easier for your family all round.