Transfer of Property Ownership

akery

Hi,

Prior to the death of my husband in 2012, the property that I live in was jointly-owned by myself and my husband as 'tenants in common'.

In accordance with his last will and testament, his half share in the property should have been transferred into the names of our three children, in equal shares.

However, it recently came to light that I forgot to change the title deeds in line with his wishes, so I am looking to do this now.

I have read through the Land Registry website but am not finding the process easy to understand, so I am looking for some help and guidance in this respect to avoid having to employ a Solicitor.

There is no mortgage on the property, as this was paid off some years prior to my husband's death.

Questions:
　
1. Is my understanding correct that I need to fill in the following forms:

TR1
AP1
4 x ID1 forms (to prove my ID, and that of our 3 children)

2. As my husband died over 4 years ago, will the transfer now be considered as a transfer of property by gift (from myself, to myself and my 3 children)?

3. If so, as the property is worth between £100k and £200k, is the fee payable £60 (that being the full Scale 2 fee, with no reduction as this is a transfer of part)?

Many thanks in advance for any help received.

Jean

　

G_M

akery wrote: »

Hi,


Questions:
　
1. Is my understanding correct that I need to fill in the following forms:
No.

TR1
AP1
4 x ID1 forms (to prove my ID, and that of our 3 children)
Death Certificate
Grant of Probate (I assume you are Executer of your husband's will and the Grant is in your name?)

2. As my husband died over 4 years ago, will the transfer now be considered as a transfer of property by gift (from myself, to myself and my 3 children)?
Of course not. They inherit. You (as Executer I assume) are distributing his Estate as per his will.

Has Inheritance tax been paid, if required?

3. If so, as the property is worth between £100k and £200k, is the fee payable £60 (that being the full Scale 2 fee, with no reduction as this is a transfer of part)?
This is not a Transfer of Part. You are not splitting the Property Title. You are transferring the ownership of the entire property into 4 names. (thus you correctly stated above you use a TR1, not a TP1)
　
A TP1 would be used if, for example, you gave the children ownership of the garden but kept the house 100% in your name, thus creating 2 Titles.

Hope this helps.

akery

Thanks for your replies, it has helped improve my understanding greatly.

Just to confirm, this is the final distribution of the estate (everything else has been distributed) and no Inheritance tax was payable.

Taking into account the additional info you have provided me with, this is my revised understanding:

1. I need to fill in the following forms:

TR1
AP1
4 x ID1 forms (to prove my ID, and that of our 3 children)

In addition, I will need to produce the Death Certificate and Grant of Probate.

2. The transfer is not a gift, it is still an inheritance even though it’s over 4 years since my husband passed (I seem to recall at the time I distributed the rest of his estate in 2012 being told there was a time limit of 6 months to get this sorted, hence the confusion).

3. The property is worth between £100k and £200k, so the fee payable will be £30 (that being the Scale 2 fee, reduced by 50% as this is a transfer of whole).

I would be most grateful for confirmation that the above is correct, and thanks again for the extra info and help.

Jean

G_M

3) I'm no an expert (The Land Reg Rep may be along on Monday), but I think you are right:

* Scale 2 is correct for transfer of no monetary value
* £100K - £200K is £60 by post.
* I assume you will not have access to the Portal?
* 50% for Transfer of Whole

However I'd check direct with the LR.


https://www.gov.uk/guidance/land-registry-registration-services-fees

tlc678910

Hi,
Just a query for you to consider and maybe investigate.

Might owning a share of this property stop your children being eligible for any first time buyer help in the future including government schemes, or from having a help to buy ISA?

Could having a share in the property mean that your children (even if they are already adults/already own a home) have to pay an extra 3% stamp duty when they try to buy their own or next home. I think the share only counts for this if their share is worth over 40K. Their shares might not be worth that now but might be by the time they are ready to buy.

Just worth considering in case it is possible/acceptable to buy out their shares (e.g. with a mortgage) allowing them to invest the money and avoid these issues. Would also mean that when they want to buy the cash is accessible rather than locked in your property.

Tlc

Land_Registry

Akery - appreciate that others have already posted useful advice but the following may also help.

The property was registered in your joint names so you were the joint legal owners. When you husband sadly passed away that legal ownership past to you.
The tenancy in common aspect was presumably in place to protect your respective wishes re the beneficial ownership, namely what you each wished to happen in the event of your death, in his case his 'share' passing to the children.

It is important to distinguish between the legal and beneficial ownerships. This is especially true where the surviving legal owner for example remains in the property as I assume has happened here.

Probate is not required to then deal with the legal estate, namely the property here as you are the sole surviving legal owner. You may therefore deal with the property yourself but must appreciate the TIC impact were you to sell/mortgage for example.

However that is not what you want to do here so if you wish to transfer it from your sole legal ownership to you and the three children then you may do so but it is you who would transfer the whole (you cannot transfer a share of the legal title) to the four of you.

So forms AP1 (application form), TR1 (legal deed transferring ownership) and ID1 x 4 are correct. We would also require an official copy of the death certificate.

The fee would be payable under Scale 2 as you rightly suggest but you need to divide the value by 4 (number of shares involved) here to get the right value/amount. So that would bring the value down to between £25K and £50K so the fee would be £40.
(Not too sure where the 50% reduction you referred to comes from unless you were referring to an electronic application - I'm afraid that only applies to where a business customer is submitting it through our e-services, which would not be available to you here)

So that then leaves the TIC aspect to consider as I assume that there is a form A restriction on the title and that the four of you may well wish to consider what happens to your 'shares' int them same way as both you and your late husband did.

The linked guidance explains how joint ownership can be reflected but such matters are invariably kept off the register with only the form A entered to reflect the fact that the 'trust' exists for example.

The form TR1 and guidance notes help explain how the four of you can indicate how you wish to hold the property e.g. as TIC. But often, as you and your late husband did, you will record what each share is and happens to them in more detail, be that in your wills or a trust deed or a declaration of trust for example. Those details are then private to you as they relate to the beneficial ownership. They do not appear on the registered title and we do not require such details as we deal with the legal ownership.

And finally, if you do decide to hold as TIC then the existing restriction will remain on the register as in essence, the TIC it was protecting still exists albeit under altered terms of course.

G_M

Land_Registry_representative wrote: »

(Not too sure where the 50% reduction you referred to comes from unless you were referring to an electronic application - I'm afraid that only applies to where a business customer is submitting it through our e-services, which would not be available to you here)

.

Hi LRR - that's not clear from your list of fees here which says:

Fee reductions when using scale 2

There are reduced fees (50% reduction) for:

• transfers of whole
• charges of whole
• transfer of charges
• many other applications of whole for registered titles when using the portal or Business Gateway

Are you saying the words "when using the portal or Business Gateway" apply to all 4 bullet points, not just the 4th?

getmore4less

Did your husband not give you a life interest?
and lay out terms for maintenance of the property.

If not then there will be CGT considerations for the other beneficial owners.

akery

TLC – None of our children are first time buyers, nor do I expect any of them will buy an additional home. Thanks for the suggestion though.

getmore4less – I have no idea if my husband gave me a life interest and/or laid out the terms for maintenance of the property. Should this have been included in our wills at the time, if they were properly drawn up?

LR OCR – Thanks for the detailed reply.

You are correct in assuming the TIC aspect was put in place to protect our wishes re the beneficial ownership, i.e. my husband’s 'share' passing to the children on death. Also, that I have remained in the property.

Therefore, based on what you've said:

- Probate is not required, as I am the sole surviving legal owner



- this is a transfer (by myself) of the whole to the 4 of us



- the documentation needed is:



AP1 (application form)
TR1 (legal deed transferring ownership)
ID1 x 4
Copy death certificate



- the fee is payable under Scale 2 and the band is 0 to £100,000, based on the number of shares involved. As you say, the fee for this is £40 according to the Land Registry site. However, it refers to scale 2 fee reductions beneath the table, saying there is a 50% reduction for transfers of whole. Have I read this wrong in that these reductions only apply when using the portal or Business Gateway, then?

I was not familiar with a form A restriction before now. However, I assume this would have been put in place at the time we became TIC. Do I need to check this before proceeding further, or will the Land Registry do this when they receive my paperwork?

Once again, thanks to all for the advice – I wouldn’t have stood a chance without this forum!

Jean

Land_Registry

G_M wrote: »

Hi LRR - that's not clear from your list of fees here which says:

Are you saying the words "when using the portal or Business Gateway" apply to all 4 bullet points, not just the 4th?

It applies to all 4 bullet points - unfortunately they have included the final words as part of bullet point 4. I'll get them amended
Many thanks for pointing it out

G_M

So:

Fee reductions when using scale 2

There are reduced fees (50% reduction) when using the portal or Business Gateway for:

• transfers of whole
• charges of whole
• transfer of charges
• many other applications of whole for registered titles