Do you tip in restaurants?

balabooberlies

Perhaps I can help a little here.........

I haven't read the whole thread but get the gist of both sides of the argument.

I worked for many years as a waitress and yes it's normally minimum wage but unlike many (not all) other jobs on this pay scale it requires a tremendous amount from you on more than one level.

It's an incredibly demanding physical job because if you work for a good establishment it should be busy.

You are not just dealing with the wants and needs of one customer at a time, but many. Sometimes my 'station' had 20-30 people. On busy nights they could all be sat within a 15 minute time frame. You have to greet them, take their order for drinks, make sure they are comfortable. Then serve their drinks, take their order, pass that order to the kitchen making sure that any special requirements are brought to the attention of the chefs who are under extreme pressure in what is a hot steamy environment.

You do none of this from a standing still position.

So, seat and greet, hand out menus, take drinks order, take that to the bar, remember to collect said drinks as quickly as possible, take food order, deliver that to kitchen where chefs will grab you to deliver food to someone else's table as food must not get cold. Rush back to your own station to deal with your own customers. Oh......when you deliver food to other waiters table you don't just drop it off you have to do the job properly....offering pepper etc. Whatever is appropriate and you must not seem rushed.

You are constantly multi-tasking, having to remember where everything is in the queue.

Okay, that was mostly physical. Let's get to the interesting bit. The customers.

The lovely ones, the well mannered polite ones are the majority. Thank goodness but you do get all sorts. Am not going to describe them here but you have to deal with them with a smile on your face. Even when all you want to do is ask them to leave. And I won't even begin to tell you how my blood would simmer with parents that abdicated all responsibility of their children once they came through the doors allowing them to run around causing mahem in an environment where the staff are carrying hot heavy plates/drinks. I witnessed many near accidents where it was only the agility and awareness of the staff that made it a 'near' miss. Parents sitting unconcerned.

A good waiter/ess has to give of their own personality to create an ambiance that makes that customer want to come back. You have to be attentive to their needs. Some customers want very little interaction, others more. You have to be able to judge that situation and act accordingly. You give alot of yourself. You are not selling something that has been manufactured. You have to create the product along with the chef because the 'product' is an experience. Otherwise you may as well get a take away and eat the food at home.

One of my favourite evenings was when I was 'seated' with a couple, two men in their fifties. I went about my job as usual when one of them pulled me aside and said there was no need for me to give them V.I.P treatment as they did not eat out often. I thought I was just giving my usual standard of service.

Well, you can guess the rest. Every Friday night like clockwork they came in to partake of our service and sometimes brought their families in on Sundays for lunch. When the restaurant was re-located they followed us. This carried on until they retired early and moved to Barbados !

You make friends of your customers and they reward you by returning.

I loved my job and I was really good at it because at the heart of it all I wanted was for my customers to go away feeling that they had been well taken care of. No other job requires you to take care of so many clients all at the same time, offering them all the same standard of excellence.

Yes, I had customers that on principle would not tip. And I treated them as I treated any other. I had my standards and nobody was messing about with that. However, I am glad that they were the minority.

Takmon

balabooberlies wrote: »

Perhaps I can help a little here.........

I haven't read the whole thread but get the gist of both sides of the argument.

I worked for many years as a waitress and yes it's normally minimum wage but unlike many (not all) other jobs on this pay scale it requires a tremendous amount from you on more than one level.

It's an incredibly demanding physical job because if you work for a good establishment it should be busy.

You are not just dealing with the wants and needs of one customer at a time, but many. Sometimes my 'station' had 20-30 people. On busy nights they could all be sat within a 15 minute time frame. You have to greet them, take their order for drinks, make sure they are comfortable. Then serve their drinks, take their order, pass that order to the kitchen making sure that any special requirements are brought to the attention of the chefs who are under extreme pressure in what is a hot steamy environment.

You do none of this from a standing still position.

So, seat and greet, hand out menus, take drinks order, take that to the bar, remember to collect said drinks as quickly as possible, take food order, deliver that to kitchen where chefs will grab you to deliver food to someone else's table as food must not get cold. Rush back to your own station to deal with your own customers. Oh......when you deliver food to other waiters table you don't just drop it off you have to do the job properly....offering pepper etc. Whatever is appropriate and you must not seem rushed.

You are constantly multi-tasking, having to remember where everything is in the queue.

Okay, that was mostly physical. Let's get to the interesting bit. The customers.

The lovely ones, the well mannered polite ones are the majority. Thank goodness but you do get all sorts. Am not going to describe them here but you have to deal with them with a smile on your face. Even when all you want to do is ask them to leave. And I won't even begin to tell you how my blood would simmer with parents that abdicated all responsibility of their children once they came through the doors allowing them to run around causing mahem in an environment where the staff are carrying hot heavy plates/drinks. I witnessed many near accidents where it was only the agility and awareness of the staff that made it a 'near' miss. Parents sitting unconcerned.

A good waiter/ess has to give of their own personality to create an ambiance that makes that customer want to come back. You have to be attentive to their needs. Some customers want very little interaction, others more. You have to be able to judge that situation and act accordingly. You give alot of yourself. You are not selling something that has been manufactured. You have to create the product along with the chef because the 'product' is an experience. Otherwise you may as well get a take away and eat the food at home.

One of my favourite evenings was when I was 'seated' with a couple, two men in their fifties. I went about my job as usual when one of them pulled me aside and said there was no need for me to give them V.I.P treatment as they did not eat out often. I thought I was just giving my usual standard of service.

Well, you can guess the rest. Every Friday night like clockwork they came in to partake of our service and sometimes brought their families in on Sundays for lunch. When the restaurant was re-located they followed us. This carried on until they retired early and moved to Barbados !

You make friends of your customers and they reward you by returning.

I loved my job and I was really good at it because at the heart of it all I wanted was for my customers to go away feeling that they had been well taken care of. No other job requires you to take care of so many clients all at the same time, offering them all the same standard of excellence.

Yes, I had customers that on principle would not tip. And I treated them as I treated any other. I had my standards and nobody was messing about with that. However, I am glad that they were the minority.

So how have explained how you consider it to be a demanding job and how doing it well will result in more customers returning to the restaurant which then generates more profit for the restaurant owner.

Yet you still seem to think that the customers should be rewarding you for this by paying tips and not your employer?. So why is that?

When most people do a good job in work their employer rewards them. Even jobs where you deal with customers and generate more sales the employer pays commission to reward employees.

So why should restaurant staff be different ?

balabooberlies

I don't expect or think customers SHOULD tip. I didn't invent the system, I just worked in it. Because I loved it and was fortunate enough to work in some fine establishments where the management backed me up and supported my level of customer service. You would be surprised at how varying this can be.

I don't work in this industry anymore as it really is a young persons game, too gruelling physically, incredibly unsociable hours, worked too many holidays serving people whilst they had fun. Christmas, New Year, bank holidays, Valentines, Easter, Mothers day etc...... Too many nights coming home at 2 in the morning. Too many split shifts. It's why I could never have an animal. Too many hours spent away from home.

I don't really have an answer for your question because the service industry is unquantifiable. Yes there are basic broads standards that must be met but the experience is all based on the person that you get. There is no way an owner/manager of a restaurant could quantify who brought in a particular
customer and in turn through word of mouth other people. When it's a really good team all floor staff get involved and that is why I never had any problems putting all tips in a pot and it being shared equally.

Just to clarify, I tip hairdressers, cab drivers etc based on their level of service.

I guess I feel that as my job was what I made it, going the extra mile, being entertaining and charming and welcoming and most importantly interested, I absolutely felt I deserved those tips. I made them feel special, because they were. I wasn't a plate carrier/order taker......I was much more than that and today I believe machines can do the basics. What would you prefer ?

If it was just about the food then stay at home, cook it yourself, order a take-away. If you want an experience that makes you feel special for a while then find someone like Me !

:-)

Kim_kim

balabooberlies wrote: »

If it was just about the food then stay at home, cook it yourself, order a take-away. If you want an experience that makes you feel special for a while then find someone like Me
:-)

A restaurant price includes serving at the table. If people are t prepared to tip it doesn’t mean they should stay home or have a take away.

balabooberlies

Yes, but you are also paying for all energy costs, insurances, rent, rates, wages, tax, vat, etc...
AND THE FOOD AND BEVERAGES YOU CONSUME.
you were not paying for just me and my colleagues to serve you.

And yes, I could serve you, as I said, take your order and deliver it to you without any of the talent that I worked hard to acquire. I could engage with you, covering the basics of my job, but engage with you minimally. I would have done my job. As I said you would be better off saving your money and cooking for yourself because within the example I just set, there was no' experience'.

People go to restaurants, not to eat, because we all have the means to do that, but for the ambiance. For the (what should be) pleasurable atmosphere, combined with the great food and the experience of being 'Served' by a professional that seeks to meet your every need. How often do you get served at home ?

New restaurants are more likely to go out of business in the first year of trading than any other industry. Why ? Because running a good restaurant and building that business is incredibly hard. You have to have a great kitchen with chefs that know food to the nth degree so that they can keep their menu fresh and stimulating. Without that, with the best will in the world, no waiting staff could with any clear conscience serve the food with confidence. And it works the other way. Food could be great but if front of house staff just robotically take orders and deliver to tables the experience would be flat indeed. And who wants that and why would you go back ? What would be the point. You may as well have stayed at home or cooked the office Christmas Party yourself. And 'served' everyone.

There are front of house staff that have sunk all their money into opening a restaurant and have failed because they wouldn't know the first thing about cooking for many with style and an understanding of food. Also there have been great chefs that have opened restaurants and failed because stupidly they thought that all that it takes is great food.

Successful restaurants are an organic living growing entity. Not a factory !

balabooberlies

I got slightly off topic there.

I never suggested that people who didn't tip should stay at home. I understand it is a principle that people have, thankfully in the minority. But it should be respected.

What I was trying to do was paint a picture. 'Serving' people takes alot more than people understand. Especially in an industry where everything has to be produced in the moment. Not taken off a shelf ready made.

I suppose tipping was invented to encourage the whole shaping of demeanor and level of service. Who was going to be the most attentive ?

The fact is that everyone in Britain, where we are privileged enough to dine out, is aware of the system in place. What they do with that knowledge is entirely up to them. But I wonder if they would have the same opinion if they actually spent......let's say a year........working in that industry.

Now, if the industry turned upside down and I was paid £30.00 an hour for my hard won skills we wouldn't be having this conversation. And trust me I am worth more than that but that would also cover the fact that I work 6 nights a week into the early hours, have no social life of my own, my aching bones/feet etc etc.............

BUT THAT IS NEVER GOING TO HAPPEN. Ergo, this lively debate will be going on forever.

Takmon

balabooberlies wrote: »

Now, if the industry turned upside down and I was paid £30.00 an hour for my hard won skills we wouldn't be having this conversation. And trust me I am worth more than that but that would also cover the fact that I work 6 nights a week into the early hours, have no social life of my own, my aching bones/feet etc etc.............

There is no way that serving in a restaurant deserves a wage of £30 an hour. Your trying to make out it's a difficult job but in reality it's quite simple and easy to take orders, check everyone has everything and bring things to the table. That's why it's a minimum wage job and always will be.

If it was a difficult job then restaurants would find it difficult to get staff and they would have to increase wages to entice them like in other industries. But in reality it's a starter job that anyone can get into quite easily.

I think the tipping system is really bad for restaurant workers; just look at the US where they are paid very low wages and expected to make up their money by getting tips. A system where the employer recognises good employees and rewards them is far more fair to everyone.

Also I've been to a restaurant where you ordered the food on a tablet and it was then sent to your table directly on a rollercoaster track. So no staff waiting on you and it was one of the best restaurant experiences I have had.

Barny1979

balabooberlies wrote: »

Now, if the industry turned upside down and I was paid £30.00 an hour for my hard won skills we wouldn't be having this conversation.

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
How much would a meal be, if staff are on £30 an hour?!

Kim_kim

balabooberlies wrote: »

I got slightly off topic there.

I never suggested that people who didn't tip should stay at home. I understand it is a principle that people have, thankfully in the minority. But it should be respected.

What I was trying to do was paint a picture. 'Serving' people takes alot more than people understand. Especially in an industry where everything has to be produced in the moment. Not taken off a shelf ready made.

I suppose tipping was invented to encourage the whole shaping of demeanor and level of service. Who was going to be the most attentive ?

The fact is that everyone in Britain, where we are privileged enough to dine out, is aware of the system in place. What they do with that knowledge is entirely up to them. But I wonder if they would have the same opinion if they actually spent......let's say a year........working in that industry.

Now, if the industry turned upside down and I was paid £30.00 an hour for my hard won skills we wouldn't be having this conversation. And trust me I am worth more than that but that would also cover the fact that I work 6 nights a week into the early hours, have no social life of my own, my aching bones/feet etc etc.............

BUT THAT IS NEVER GOING TO HAPPEN. Ergo, this lively debate will be going on forever.

I hope if you are earning the equivalent of £30 an hour gross that you are declaring all your cash in hand income to the tax man?

strawb_shortcake

I tip occasionally when the service has been notable, on the other hand if they've not stopped asking all evening if we've enjoyed the meal and interrupted us eating and conversing then I pointedly don't tip.
A couple of local Chinese restaurants don't pass on tips to the staff so we refuse to tip there.
I think tipping should be the exception rather than the rule, restaurants should price accordingly to fully reward their staff like any other business.
A local restaurant does donate 10% of tips to a different local charity each month which is quite nice.
But we rarely eat out now, with two teenagers and a younger child we are often looking at £70-80 a time and the food is often pretty mediocre