The thread for pointless arguments about Brexit

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

Sapphire wrote: »

Good. .

And in other news....

Ford to consider closing UK factories in Leave towns after Brexit

Ford has said it will consider closing its two remaining UK automobile factories, both of which are in towns where the majority of people voted to leave the EU, to cover Brexit costs of $1 billion over the next two years. Ford makes engines at plants in Dagenham and Bridgend that are exported to the EU where the cars are assembled.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/ford-to-consider-closing-uk-factories-in-leave-towns-after-brexit-a7162561.html

As I may have mentioned a few hundred times previously - it's the very working classes that most voted out - which will feel all of the pain and none of the gain from Brexit.

The politicians that sold them a dud may want to watch their backs...

stator

Bad article that. Doesn't explain WHY brexit is costing Ford anything. I suppose they are simply talking about the exchange rate, but that's their fault for not manufacturing cars in the UK. All importers will be in the same boat so car prices will just go up.

Unless we know whether we will have access to the free market I don't see why theyr would close factories in the UK since the pound has fallen you should be bringing more manufacturing here.

Thrugelmir

stator wrote: »

Unless we know whether we will have access to the free market I don't see why theyr would close factories in the UK since the pound has fallen you should be bringing more manufacturing here.

59% of the components used in the manufacture of cars in the UK are imported. Likewise the UK exports components to Europe. Which are then reimported in finished vehicles. So it's far from being as black and white as it appears.

Kohoutek

stator wrote: »

Bad article that. Doesn't explain WHY brexit is costing Ford anything. I suppose they are simply talking about the exchange rate, but that's their fault for not manufacturing cars in the UK. All importers will be in the same boat so car prices will just go up.

There's another article in the FT, the $1 billion is GBP devaluation and expected lower car sales in the UK. They are going to increase prices in the UK.

BobQ

stator wrote: »

Bad article that. Doesn't explain WHY brexit is costing Ford anything. I suppose they are simply talking about the exchange rate, but that's their fault for not manufacturing cars in the UK. All importers will be in the same boat so car prices will just go up.

Unless we know whether we will have access to the free market I don't see why theyr would close factories in the UK since the pound has fallen you should be bringing more manufacturing here.

But they seem to be arguing that the cars vehicles they make are predominantly for EXPORT. So why should they make the cars in the UK if it costs them more to do?

BobQ

Returning to the original aim of the thread, I would say one positive is that most of us have begun to realise that the argument is not as black and white as it once appeared. As a remainer, I still think we have made the wrong decision, but I also accept more than I once did that there are some potential benefits of leaving and that the future may not be as bad as I once feared. Equally I would hope that those who voted for Brexit are beginning to realise that implementation of a Brexit is not as easy as they once thought, that there are some negative consequences and that things cannot happen as quickly as they hoped.

All that said, Brexit will have winners and losers and I still think that the irony of the situation is that many of those losers will be the very people who voted for it.

But what I find sad is that the decision demonstrates to the world that we remain an arrogant people, clinging to our past, showing contempt for foreigners and insular in our outlook.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

stator wrote: »

Unless we know whether we will have access to the free market I don't see why they would close factories in the UK since the pound has fallen you should be bringing more manufacturing here.

Merely having "access to" the EU market isn't enough though.

As many of us noted and warned people about before the referendum.

Retaining all the EU market manufacturing in the UK would require staying fully in the Single Market to keep costs down, not just from tariffs, but also from things like customs paperwork.

And even then, without any input on setting the rules, it is entirely likely that over time British manufacturing interests would become less and less well represented resulting in it's decline.

There's a reason that the leading pro-Brexit economist Prof Patrick Minford (from 'Economists for Brexit') said this in an interview for Parliament before the referendum....

“Over time, if we left the EU, it seems likely that we would mostly eliminate manufacturing, leaving mainly industries such as design, marketing and hi-tech."

Those manufacturing heartlands in the North of England and Midlands are, over the coming years, more than likely going to see first hand the sort of wholesale job losses that they haven't seen since the 70's and 80's.

seven-day-weekend

A positive thing that I have found out is that we will still be able to enter the Eurovision Song Contest :rotfl::rotfl:

BobQ

seven-day-weekend wrote: »

A positive thing that I have found out is that we will still be able to enter the Eurovision Song Contest :rotfl::rotfl:

This is a positive? How easily pleased you are. :rotfl:

Thrugelmir

BobQ wrote: »

But what I find sad is that the decision demonstrates to the world that we remain an arrogant people, clinging to our past, showing contempt for foreigners and insular in our outlook.

Applies more to the cottage industry that Brussels has become. In an era of decentralising power. Local government is fact more effective and accountable. Shows also that the UK is forward thinking and not afraid of change for the better. If something doesn't work you fix it. Not paper over the cracks for political unity. Personally I hope that the UK's voice will create change for the better.