WASPI Campaign .... State Pensions

Malthusian

jamesd wrote: »

I suppose the three of five founders could register WASPI as a trademark and take ownership of the accounts back into the hands of the WASPI leadership that way.

But WASPI2 would surely immediately oppose WASPI3's trademark application. And given that W2 have the website and the Facebook page and therefore all the materials in which the WASPI name is used publicly, I would have thought that it would be them granted the trademark, not W3. I'm not an expert on trademarks but I don't think trademarks are granted to whoever has the most signatures on the application.

They might also consider complaining to Facebook and Twitter about the coup by those who happen to have the passwords at the moment and seek to have them changed and handed to the majority of the WASPI leadership.

Facebook almost certainly won't give a damn, I can tell you that much, being an admin of a large group myself. Whoever has the passwords now will keep them. Facebook almost never responds to disputes over who owns a group page or in fact any requests for help whatsoever (unless you're really famous). I'm less familiar with Twitter.

However, if Facebook or Twitter do decide to look at who should own the "official" WASPI pages, they will probably consider the fact that W2 controls the website and W2 controls all the other social media accounts and conclude that W2 is therefore the real Waspi. If they email Waspi's official email account (i.e. @waspi.co.uk) to ask who's the real one, W2 will reply to say it's them.

For all intents and purposes W2 is Waspi. They own the passwords and they own the original "ask" to put 1950s-born women back to a State Pension age of 60. There may be only two of them but they are occupying all the defensible ground.

I agree with the above, it's a hell of a soap opera.

bmm78

While Waspi’s strategic failings are obvious and their ethics highly questionable, it has to be acknowledged that they have been very successful in raising the profile of their cause.

The concern though is that a combination of selfishness, stubbornness and arrogance will scupper any possibility of a positive outcome for the women affected. The plight of those affected by state pension age rises is much more important than the egos of Anne Keen and her cronies, who seem intent on fighting battles they have no hope of winning. Supporters are faced with the unfair choice of continuing to back a campaign and personalities that they find repellent, or being excluded from a cause they have devoted countless hours to. It's hard not to feel sympathy for them.

Personally, I think that the women affected would be better off taking the initiative themselves, and don’t necessarily need Waspi anymore. They are able to speak to their MPs without the consent of Waspi. They shouldn’t need Waspi to tell them what their “aims” are. If they believe they have a case for maladministration against the DWP, they have a much better chance of success with a personalised complaint than they do with a Waspi template sent at the same time as thousands of other identical letters. The chance of any legal case against the 2011 Pensions Act would be dependent on individual circumstances, which a class action would not capture and therefore be doomed to failure (especially if fixated on the 1995 Act).

Waspi have alienated many previously supportive MPs with their recent actions, which may have caused irreparable damage to the campaign. These MPs could probably do with a reminder that many supporters are just normal women who want a bit of help. The campaign has filled their heads with misinformation, fuelled greed with unrealistic expectations and provided validation for extreme views. Ultimately though, any concession the government provides will be well received and positive PR.

Pennylane

bmm78 wrote: »

While Waspi’s strategic failings are obvious and their ethics highly questionable, it has to be acknowledged that they have been very successful in raising the profile of their cause.

The concern though is that a combination of selfishness, stubbornness and arrogance will scupper any possibility of a positive outcome for the women affected. The plight of those affected by state pension age rises is much more important than the egos of Anne Keen and her cronies, who seem intent on fighting battles they have no hope of winning. Supporters are faced with the unfair choice of continuing to back a campaign and personalities that they find repellent, or being excluded from a cause they have devoted countless hours to. It's hard not to feel sympathy for them.

Personally, I think that the women affected would be better off taking the initiative themselves, and don’t necessarily need Waspi anymore. They are able to speak to their MPs without the consent of Waspi. They shouldn’t need Waspi to tell them what their “aims” are. If they believe they have a case for maladministration against the DWP, they have a much better chance of success with a personalised complaint than they do with a Waspi template sent at the same time as thousands of other identical letters. The chance of any legal case against the 2011 Pensions Act would be dependent on individual circumstances, which a class action would not capture and therefore be doomed to failure (especially if fixated on the 1995 Act).

Waspi have alienated many previously supportive MPs with their recent actions, which may have caused irreparable damage to the campaign. These MPs could probably do with a reminder that many supporters are just normal women who want a bit of help. The campaign has filled their heads with misinformation, fuelled greed with unrealistic expectations and provided validation for extreme views. Ultimately though, any concession the government provides will be well received and positive PR.

trust me there are plenty of local groups (working separately from WASPI) meeting with their MPs, campaigning and writing lots of letters. THe pressure is very much still on.

Daniel54

Pennylane wrote: »

trust me there are plenty of local groups (working separately from WASPI) meeting with their MPs, campaigning and writing lots of letters. THe pressure is very much still on.

What is it that you are campaigning for - and please don't say fair transitional arrangements ,which means nothing ?

If you favour one or more of Owen Smith's six alternatives ( none of which involve backdating to pre 1995 ),it would seem sensible to contact the APPG directly.It's very hard to see them being able to support the Waspi2 ask

Following your last intervention on this thread,I'm coming round to the idea the Government could do something worthwhile by increasing the carers' allowance and leaving the existing SPA arrangements well alone.

bmm78

Pennylane wrote: »

trust me there are plenty of local groups (working separately from WASPI) meeting with their MPs, campaigning and writing lots of letters. THe pressure is very much still on.

That's good. A difficult. but probably necessary consideration is the point at which the Waspi name becomes a hindrance rather than a help. They seem to be hell-bent on fighting an unwinnable legal battle, which would effectively shut the door on any political concession for fear of prejudicing future legal proceedings.

Personally I think the revamped Waspi is a liability to any progress, and it's silly that some women are waiting for a tarnished Waspi to tell them what they should be asking for and how they should be expressing it. Virtually all MPs are aware of the issue now, and it's just as important to work on what sympathetic MPs are actually willing to support, as it is trying to change the minds of negative MPs.

slightlymiffed

It's official. Good.

http://www.ftadviser.com/2016/08/09/pensions/waspi-split-was-military-style-coup-says-faction-tydlMc7mRfjFcH5G3A2fKL/article-1.html

Pennylane

JEzza Corbyn says he backs the WASPI campaign. Can't make my mind up about that one!

Silvertabby

I'm a newcomer to these boards and haven't read all of this thread, but I'm going to stick my neck out and say that, as a 60 year old female, I'm sick of all the whinges about the increase in State pension age and so-called 'losses' The increases were well publicised at the time - I know this for a fact as my very poorly mum had a right chew on about the increase in my and my sister's State pension ages not long before she died at the end of 1995. She certainly didn't read any government white papers on the issue - just the normal tabloid press. Yes, I have sympathy with those of us who have had our State pension ages subsequently increased from 65 to 66, but that's life. In hindsight, the equalisation of State pension ages should have been part of the 1975 Sex Equality Act - an increase of 1 year per decade wef 1990 would have been do-able.

atush

Mine has been increased (in two countries lol). Am I complaining? No.


i was complaining about equal pay, and equal pension ages for all (even though a woman).

Honestly- what is the problem? Do you want equality or dont you? if you want equality you have to take the good with the bad. So get over it?

But I have to say there still isnt equal pay for equal work. but that is a harder to define area. and yet age isnt.

Age is easy, so it has to be equal. WE just need more action on the equal pay/work thing.

That is where protests should be- NOT with Waspi.

molerat

Pennylane wrote: »

JEzza Corbyn says he backs the WASPI campaign. Can't make my mind up about that one!

Just support grabbing - he can say whatever will please those he wants to get support from. Let's face it, he is never going to be in a position to do anything about it.