Taylor Wimpey & Sewage smells

McDougal44

Sorry this is a bit of a long read, I have tried to summarise as best as possible, looking for some advice/guidance:

Moved in end of November 2012 to a Taylor Wimpey new build. Since moving in the rooms at the back of the house have intermittently smelt of sewage (ground floor living room, 1st floor bedroom 2, 2nd floor ensuite & airing cupboard) which the smell has also affected the 2nd floor master bedroom (being attached to the ensuite), 1st floor bathroom (next to bedroom 2) and ground floor hallway.

Boxed in to the smelly rooms is a waste pipe running from the 2nd floor ensuite, down through bedroom 2 and the living room and then under the property to the front of the house where it joins the sewer.

We assumed that as the smell was intermittent it was myself and the OH who were blocking the toilet, causing a smell. It seemed to come and go, sometimes was barely detectable but others unbearable.

1st half of May this year we had to keep all doors and windows open day and night to dissipate the sewage smell which was very strong at the beginning of the day and in the evening. We contacted Taylor Wimpey on 17th May after calling out a plumber who found no problem with our drain pipes. We asked TW for technical drawings showing the Service Vent Pipe as instructed by our plumber, as he thought the smell was caused by a faulty Durgo (air admittance) valve stuck open.

Initially TW provided plans showing it was on the 1st floor (17th May). The smell became unbareable and on 19th May we hired a builder to put holes into walls to find the problem. TW finally admitted we were looking in the wrong place and provided proof the SVP went into a void behind the en-suite.

We found that a Durgo had not been fitted, so what we have been breathing in for the past 4 years was gas from other peoples waste as air moved through the sewage network. This explains why the sewage smell came and went at peak times, whenever the neighbours used their waste pipes!

TW admitted liability and said they would:
1. Make good and fit Durgo
2. Reimburse us for our costs so far (plumber & builder only)
3. Asked us to put forward a compensatory value for the past 4 years.

They did fit a Durgo and install a hatch so we could access if it breaks again (as it is located in an inaccessible void behind ensuite). They offered to reimburse for 80% costs, when I picked them up on this they did agree they should pay full costs.
However they have since offered nothing in the form of compensation as they had no notes mentioning any bad smells previously. I asked the rep we have been speaking to if he would accept what they had offered with it had happened to him, his response was “No I wouldn’t”.

They have been late with the deadlines they have set themselves, failed to send out staff when they said they would and I have had to do most of the chasing myself. TW are now going to put us in contact with their loss adjusters/insurance provider.

Trying to prepare for any conversation with this team, does anyone know of any cases similar to this and how it was dealt with or have advice for how I can handle them?

lisa110rry

McDougal, you need a good quantity surveyor in your corner for this. Where are you located? (generally)

McDougal44

Colchester.

TW have a lot of development in the area and the plumber that was contracted during the property build visited to fix his mistake, he openly admitted he knows of at least 20 other times this has occurred at his firm...very worrying!

jbainbridge

Making them boxed in / inaccessible is stupid as they can and do fail.

McDougal44

jbrainbridge Quite right from what I have found out since!

Usually they are in the roof space, but to save on £100 worth of pipework/labour costs per property they were put in a void. Have had 3 plumbers visit in the last couple of weeks, each has said we should have been provided access due to it being a serviceable part.

Furts

McDougal44 wrote: »

jbrainbridge Quite right from what I have found out since!

Usually they are in the roof space, but to save on £100 worth of pipework/labour costs per property they were put in a void. Have had 3 plumbers visit in the last couple of weeks, each has said we should have been provided access due to it being a serviceable part.

I cannot help feeling you are a lucky fellow and should give TW a pat on the back. Yes they were shoddy and tardy, but stand back and consider your position.

You purchased your new home in the knowledge it is a property and therefore not covered by the Sale Of Goods Act. Consequently it is "Buyer Beware" so the onus was on you to scrutinise the house with a fine tooth comb and report back all defects in writing.

Thereafter you had two years to put in writing your concerns over sewer smells.

Four years have now lapsed over a fundamental, blatantly obvious, fault.

It is good that it is being sorted, it is good that TW are offering compensation. Hopefully you will learn something from this. Put it down as a lesson in life and should you purchase another new home you will be wiser.

McDougal44

Not quite

They have offered to pay less than the costs of repairs.
The repairs have been shoddy and not to standard (sorry didnt mention this earlier) and this has been admitted by TW.
They offered to put together a compensatory package and then decided to offer nothing.

We asked for plans previously, they were not provided. We reasonably thought that the problem was of our own causing. TW hid their mistake behind a wall, making it inaccessible. How can you scrutinise what is behind the wall without knocking it down (which is then your own responsibility to rebuild)?

Furts

McDougal44 wrote: »

Not quite

They have offered to pay less than the costs of repairs.
The repairs have been shoddy and not to standard (sorry didnt mention this earlier) and this has been admitted by TW.
They offered to put together a compensatory package and then decided to offer nothing.

We asked for plans previously, they were not provided. We reasonably thought that the problem was of our own causing. TW hid their mistake behind a wall, making it inaccessible. How can you scrutinise what is behind the wall without knocking it down (which is then your own responsibility to rebuild)?

I appreciate your point but within reason it is not possible to create drain smells. All your basins, baths and toilets have traps on them to prevent smells.

Your problem should have been bounced back to TW, immediately and in writing, and here you made a mistake.

I would not expect TW to forward working drawings and I have never experienced this in my professional life. These drawings are Copyright and the property of TW. Your request was similar to asking for CAD details from Ford to build your own Focus.

It is a statement of the obvious...you bought a new home and had the opportunity to look up at the roof. As such it is not rocket science to ask "Is a svp visible and if not why?" If the answer is "no" you go in the attic and look for the Durgo/air admittance valve. If you do not see one the alarm bells will start to ring.

You then ask where is it and why is it not visible. Further, this will be the mindset behind the TW approach to you. They will say you had two years in which to do this simple procedure - this being the builders liability period.

What you have experienced is unsatisfactory. It is also unacceptable. That said it is typical when buying a new home - it goes with the territory. That is why a simple logic like I have stated has to be adopted.

Bluntly, anybody buying a new home has to have their wits about them, and be alert for every defect one can imagine.

You could say my post is not helping you. What I am trying to do is explain how you will be viewed by TW. If you put yourself into that mindset you will understand a satisfactory resolution will be a battle. TW really do not want to know and you have a weak position because you have not followed simple, pre-agreed, procedures.

McDougal44

Furts clearly you are far more experienced than we are being first time buyers buying off plan!

While I appreciate your comments we have diverged slightly from the question.
TW have admitted liability and I am asking for advice as to how to deal with the loss adjusters to best put forward our case.

xyz123

Did you actually contact TW before may this year about this specific problem?

Furts

McDougal44 wrote: »

Furts clearly you are far more experienced than we are being first time buyers buying off plan!

While I appreciate your comments we have diverged slightly from the question.
TW have admitted liability and I am asking for advice as to how to deal with the loss adjusters to best put forward our case.

You know all the nitty-gritty detail - I do not. You are at the mercy of TW goodwill. My intuition is the goodwill sum offered might be £500. They might not be this generous, but offering less risks somebody saying they are not taking you seriously.

Be realistic here - you can show no proof of any losses anywhere, or any ill health, or anything else, so why should TW be offering anything other than a token sum.

Also be realistic over the plumber you called out. It sounds like you paid an incompetent individual, and you made a poor choice of plumber. Why should TW reimburse your actions in this situation?

Again you might think I am being harsh - but I am simply pointing out how typical house builders operate. They are a business and they do not want to give away any money to anybody - as you are experiencing.

Ultimately you may have to decide to forget all about this, put it down to life, and move on. Some things are not worth the hassle.