The EU: IN or OUT?

teddysmum

enthusiasticsaver wrote: »

Many of those migrants are working and paying tax though? In the university I work in we have many EU lecturers in mathematics due to the chronic shortage we have of mathematics post- graduates. In our local hospital we have agency nurses (from inside and outside EU, mainly Philopines) and locum doctors earning thousands of pounds for just the odd shift due to a shortage of nurses, doctors, midwives etc. Someone told me today there is a massive shortage of paramedics so again if we do not use migrants and there are no British born paramedics training what happens then? Our local GP has come out of retirement because they could not find a replacement. This is Cornwall by the way not a horrible place to live. If we did not have immigration who is going to do the jobs left by the migrants?

Myself and a colleague jokingly said do we have to send back our German and Italian maths lecturers and very hard working Polish cleaners and get back a load of elderly ex pats from Spain? If we had a points based system we will still have lots of immigrants due to skills shortages in this country. That is not due to the EU but a massive problem with training people in this country in the right skill sets and getting people to train for these jobs in the first place. Low paid, unskilled workers may be a different issue but the problem there is unscrupulous employers. I am not sure a right wing Conservative government will do anything about that especially without the EU to watch over them.

The EU is not perfect by any means but isolating ourselves in the way Brexiteers want to is not the answer in my opinion.

The leavers have no objection to immigration in general.


They want a points system so we can take and welcome people who have skills that we need (ie doctors, nurses, engineers ), but don't have to take those who are uneducated,don't or don't want to speak English and have little or no skill, so could spend a lot of time unemployed or begging/stealing.


Being forced to take anyone , also makes a male/female imbalance , as more males come, leaving their families behind and , when the current influx of mainly young unskilled males gets permission to reside in the EU, they too will be able to come here, further upsetting the balance.

Krissy306

Glad to see so many people voting out I was worried not many people would. What's all this about pencils being used rather than pens? I voted postal so didnt attend a polling station

Dird

benjus wrote: »

If we have a shambles now, it's largely due to the incompetence of British governments. The Leave campaign has made it a policy to blame everything on the EU. For example, if there aren't enough school places, it's because the government hasn't done its job.

No government can afford to build 300 new primary schools & 100 new high schools every 3 years

AndyBSG wrote: »

Last year the UK population grew by 513,000 and the net migration figure was 315,000 so we actually had more migrants coming into the country than we actually had in terms of the net increase of the indigenous population.

200k net birth/death increase? People need to stop !!!!ing like rabbits

enthusiasticsaver wrote: »

The EU is not perfect by any means but isolating ourselves in the way Brexiteers want to is not the answer in my opinion.

"Isolation"...like USA, Singapore, Dubai, Oman, Turkey, Canada, China, Japan, Korea? Far more countries adopt the "isolation" approach than leaving their doors open and allowing anyone to walk in the country. It's quite simple and applies to most other countries; want a new Math teacher? He can come from Germany. Want a new cleaner? Hire locally

JohnRo

Someone told me today there is a massive shortage of paramedics so again if we do not use migrants and there are no British born paramedics training what happens then?

The NHS sell off will accelerate, the pace of welfare state destruction will pick up and the multi nationals and immigrants leaving a failing UK economy for the EU will all be blamed for everything, again.

benjus

krissycontagious wrote: »

Glad to see so many people voting out I was worried not many people would. What's all this about pencils being used rather than pens? I voted postal so didnt attend a polling station

Apparently MI5 is going around with erasers to doctor ballot papers of Leave voters.

I don't know who started this rumour, although some sources suggest it came from UKIP. Which would not surprise me - I used to work with one of their candidates and it sounds like the kind of thing he would say.

It doesn't really make much sense though:

• Erasing the X is unlikely to remove it completely - there would still be an impression left behind
• It would be a lot easier to add a second cross in the Remain box which would void the ballot paper. Using a pen won't do much to protect against that. They could also destroy the Leave papers and replace them with new ones voting for Remain.

BananaRepublic

jimjames wrote: »

Or the elderly have a false sense of nostalgia for the past that the young don't. Interesting article by AA Gill along those lines. "Brexit is the fond belief that Britain is worse now than at some point in the foggy past where we achieved peak Blighty" http://www.twtd.co.uk/forum/376668/3260348/#.V2vIhmf2bcs

Everything was fantastic before we joined the EU. Except Britain being known as "the sick man of Europe", the devaluation of our currency, the strikes, 3 day week, restricted trade. Would you want the days where an Allegro was one of the few car we could drive as imports were limited/expensive?

It may be true that long term we could prosper outside the EU. I'm not sure how many people would be prepared to wait 20 years or more for that to happen. If it takes 5-10 years to negotiate a trade deal the expectation seems to be that immediately we have a massive trade based on it. In reality that seems highly unlikely and those markets would build over time.

With a massive current account deficit and large government borrowings I don't think the markets would have patience to fund UK even if citizens were prepared to wait.

If we leave then I think you will find out VERY quickly that things can get much worse and will get worse fast. Based on predictions from the likes of Soros I'd expect up to 20% drop in the pound within days. That will lead to all imports rising in price so fuel will increase 10-15p a litre within a week or two. It certainly won't be a benign situation in the short term - that's up to 5 years and could get a lot worse before it gets better.
Interest rates have been stable for a long time, mortgage rates low and low inflation. Rising inflation, dropping economy will not make a good combination.
Scaremongering? I don't think so, just the reality of globalisation and how markets will move against us when there is such a huge element of uncertainly and risk mixed in when we aren't in a great position economically.

We were a member of the EU during the Winter of Discontent. It was not the EU that sorted out the strikes, but UK politicians. The EU made no contribution whatsoever.

As for Soros, he must likely has a stake in the outcome, and he is not going to prejudice the result, so I don't think we can beleive a word that he says on the matter.

Pincher

Thunder and lightning, the heavens are weeping.

All rather portentious, don't you think?

I would like to think that Brexit is the calalyst for some Epoque making event.

On the other hand, it's a brilliant bit of marketing for Independence Day.

blutto

If in the early hours tomorrow Britain has voted narrowly for in,then this is not the END for sure for outers!

1. This whole vote is actually POINTLESS as its not LEGALLY - BINDING!

2. The euro will fall I feel as I think NOT get better,just worse especially for SOUTHERN EUROPE.

3 .Economic Migrants not refugees situation is going to get ALOT worse,you wait! Then will see uprising in other countries out of frustration with the ELITE,the useless elite!:rotfl:

4.Cameron:rotfl: yesterday's man will be forced to go by the ToRy backbenchers over the way he himself has personally handled this whole joke of a referendum what ever the result! He should have stayed out of it and let his lieutenants do the fighting and been above the politics in this matter as the guy that would do the will of the people after the result!ohh god Amber Rudd and the other woman after a plum job! :T

5. George (project fear) Osbourne will have to go from the Treasury as he lied and manipulated so much fear tactics that his own backbenchers feel he has lost all credit ability! :rotfl:

Sad day for all normal folk as this elite experiment is just a complete joke!:T

Remain will probably just edge it in the end because of all the lemmings out there but there's more trouble ahead for the Euro zone and the madness of Merkel!

Lets just hope that someone new as PM can unite the country in some way and if indeed its is an out victory Cameron tries not to sell us down the swanny and fight for the out result!

Remember if indeed the uk votes OUT they can ignore the result as not legally binding and would not be surprised if we have another one ,(like they did years ago in Denmark I think to join the Eu) to get the vote the ELITE want! :mad:

masonic

Pincher wrote: »

Thunder and lightning, the heavens are weeping.

All rather portentious, don't you think?

I would like to think that Brexit is the calalyst for some Epoque making event.

On the other hand, it's a brilliant bit of marketing for Independence Day.

It seems to be focused around the channel. Perhaps the smiting of immigrants has begun already

http://www.lightningmaps.org/blitzortung/europe/index.php?lang=en

BananaRepublic

I voted after work. I have never seen the polling station so full, with queues inside, and the normally empty road outside lined with cars. Whatever the outcome, our area is taking it very seriously. That is good even if the unwashed masses vote incorrectly.