Psychic readings

takman

Andypandyboy wrote: »

Anecdotal evidence is qualitiative though. If enough people are convinced of something then that, in itself, is "evidential".

Like i said earlier in the thread. In Korea most people are convinced that if you leave a fan on at night in an enclosed room while you sleep you will die.
So do you also believe this to be true because of this "evidence"?.

Most people would answer with certainty that cold water freezes faster than hot water. Does this mean there is enough evidence to support this?. When in reality if your time it the hot water will freeze first.

Andypandyboy

takman wrote: »

Like i said earlier in the thread. In Korea most people are convinced that if you leave a fan on at night in an enclosed room while you sleep you will die.
So do you also believe this to be true because of this "evidence"?.

Most people would answer with certainty that cold water freezes faster than hot water. Does this mean there is enough evidence to support this?. When in reality if your time it the hot water will freeze first.

They are convinced because they live in a state where free thought is discouraged so when the press issues a government report such as this:

South Korean government

The Korea Consumer Protection Board (KCPB), a South Korean government-funded public agency, issued a consumer safety alert in 2006 warning that "asphyxiation from electric fans and air conditioners" was among South Korea's five most common summer accidents or injuries, according to data they collected.[12] The KCPB published the following:

If bodies are exposed to electric fans or air conditioners for too long, it causes [the] bodies to lose water and [causes] hypothermia. If directly in contact with [air current from] a fan, this could lead to death from [an] increase of carbon dioxide saturation concentration [sic] and decrease of oxygen concentration. The risks are higher for the elderly and patients with respiratory problems. From 2003 [to] 2005, a total of 20 cases were reported through the CISS involving asphyxiations caused by leaving electric fans and air conditioners on while sleeping. To prevent asphyxiation, timers should be set, wind direction should be rotated, and doors should be left open.

they accept it at face value and do not employ any critical thinking. I don't think that is analogous with the existence of pyschic abilities.

Person_one

Andypandyboy wrote: »

I imagine it is something that you only believe in if it happens to you and you are able to critically evaluate it to your own satisfaction.

The thing is though, a lot of the stuff that people claim is evidence of 'psychic ability' has happened to non-believers but they just accepted it as coincidence or intuition or lucky guessing.

I recently 'knew' a colleague of mine was pregnant weeks before she announced it when she was actively trying to hide it. I'm not psychic, but I guessed and was right.

A friend of mine sent me a link to a job last week that arrived in my email inbox just as I was actually looking at the same job myself having found it separately. Neither of us are psychic, that was a coincidence.

Loads of people have 'sensed' when a relationship will end, or that a friend's partner is cheating, or that somebody is gay or transgender when they are actively trying to hide the fact or not fully aware of it themselves, we've all had somebody phone just as we were thinking about them. We've all seen loads of details about other people's lives on Facebook and through gossip and unexpected connections so that if we wanted to we could tell them stuff they'd never expect us to know.

Andypandyboy

You are correct of course, but if someone really thinks about all of those things and is then still convinced that the detailed information was unknown to anyone else (as Cyantist appears to be) then I don't think that you can discount their evaluation. You can be personally sceptical, but you cannot completely discount it.

Some of your examples are co incidence and guesswork, which you are supposing are what pyschics use, but other instances cannot be so easily explained away by indivduals to themselves.

Dill

I haven't read through all the thread, and hope the OP has found some peace of mind, whatever the outcome.

On the subject of psychics and clairvoyants, I wanted to share this story which I saw in the paper today.

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/justice-is-on-the-cards-as-tarot-reader-finds-killer-has-something-to-confess-7v0bk2h8c

A murderer was caught by a tarot card reader in Brighton after the killer confessed when the cards he picked out included death, justice and the devil.

The fortune teller, Jayne Braiden, phoned 999 and kept Star Randel-Hanson, talking for an hour until police arrived after he admitted stabbing his housemate Derick Marney, 70, a spiritualist.

So there you have it.. he bumped off a spiritualist, then went to see a tarot reader! :rotfl: Really shouldn't laugh but it does have its funny side.

Person_one

Andypandyboy wrote: »

You are correct of course, but if someone really thinks about all of those things and is then still convinced that the detailed information was unknown to anyone else (as Cyantist appears to be) then I don't think that you can discount their evaluation. You can be personally sceptical, but you cannot completely discount it.

This is why it works and why people are convinced though. They think they've considered every single possibility and the only remaining explanation is paranormal.

Its far more likely that they haven't actually considered every single possibility, they're only human and there will be things that are outside the scope of their experience or that are so cynical most people's minds don't work that way. An outsider who doesn't know all the exact details and all the people involved and every single detail is not likely to be able to swoop in with an easy explanation when the person themselves can't find one, so they see that as even more confirmation of the 'psychic' ability.

no1catman

Andypandyboy wrote: »

I imagine it is something that you only believe in if it happens to you and you are able to critically evaluate it to your own satisfaction.

Very true, having had what I can only describe as a 'spiritual experience', but not discussing it with anyone, it was a surprise when details of that were commented upon in a 'message' from a medium in a Spiritualist Church.

If your only knowledge of it comes from, press comments about 'phone psychics' - (call centre job centre paid just to keep people talking), and the boasting of Randi et al - it's maybe not surprising the stance they take.

Perhaps they should do some personal research, won't cost much- 50p in the plate.
Look forward to comments on Monday!!

Andypandyboy

Person_one wrote: »

This is why it works and why people are convinced though. They think they've considered every single possibility and the only remaining explanation is paranormal.

Its far more likely that they haven't actually considered every single possibility, they're only human and there will be things that are outside the scope of their experience or that are so cynical most people's minds don't work that way. An outsider who doesn't know all the exact details and all the people involved and every single detail is not likely to be able to swoop in with an easy explanation when the person themselves can't find one, so they see that as even more confirmation of the 'psychic' ability.

It may be far more likely, but it doesn't mean anyone else can be certain of that.

Person_one

Andypandyboy wrote: »

It may be far more likely, but it doesn't mean anyone else can be certain of that.

If there had ever been a single scrap of verifiable evidence that psychic abilities exist, you might have a point.

Not one single psychic has ever been able to demonstrate their abilities under any scrutiny using any framework for proof.

takman

Andypandyboy wrote: »

They are convinced because they live in a state where free thought is discouraged so when the press issues a government report such as this:

South Korean government

The Korea Consumer Protection Board (KCPB), a South Korean government-funded public agency, issued a consumer safety alert in 2006 warning that "asphyxiation from electric fans and air conditioners" was among South Korea's five most common summer accidents or injuries, according to data they collected.[12] The KCPB published the following:

If bodies are exposed to electric fans or air conditioners for too long, it causes [the] bodies to lose water and [causes] hypothermia. If directly in contact with [air current from] a fan, this could lead to death from [an] increase of carbon dioxide saturation concentration [sic] and decrease of oxygen concentration. The risks are higher for the elderly and patients with respiratory problems. From 2003 [to] 2005, a total of 20 cases were reported through the CISS involving asphyxiations caused by leaving electric fans and air conditioners on while sleeping. To prevent asphyxiation, timers should be set, wind direction should be rotated, and doors should be left open.

they accept it at face value and do not employ any critical thinking. I don't think that is analogous with the existence of pyschic abilities.

Actually I think that is very relevant to the belief in psychic abilities. Psychics give people information claiming that it is correct and obtained by "unconventional" means, yet every controlled test to prove these abilities fails (and they still carry on). So they are providing information expecting people to believe it just like the Koreans are provided information and expected to believe it.

Koreans believe it so much that they have recorded many deaths attributed to fans. Just like people who go to psychics believe it so much they think they are actually getting supernatural messages.

If i had a special ability and people were skeptical about it i would actively want to scientifically prove that it was genuine. So if there are so many true psychics why have none of them ever passed a scientific test.

This all reminds me of a program about a girl who claimed to be able to see inside peoples body's and diagnose illnesses. Many people in her community believed her have a real gift and she was apparently able to touch someone and instantly see any problems with them. There was many interviews with people who were genuinely shocked how good she was.
So they put 5 people in a room on chairs who sat still and didn't talk. She was simply asked to diagnose the illness/injury of each person. She spent over an hour in the room and could not even get one right, one person even had a big metal plate inside them but she even missed that.

How can any logical person come to the conclusion that psychics are real?.

If anyone here still genuinely believes in a psychics then book an appointment with one who you don't know, give a false name and just sit there quietly and don't say a word and see how good they are?. Repeat this with as many different ones as you like and then see what conclusion you come to about their abilities.