can anyone please offer advice on dealing with this child

skattykatty

As he's not due to start school in September and parents seem very anxious about this (the fact that he's not, yet, toilet trained is a big issue here) isn't going to GP and pushing for a referral an appropriate next step? A 4 year old child who has already been assessed to be functioning on the level of an 18 month old will just not be able to manage mainstream school at this stage: socially, emotionally and, even, physically.

FBaby

Your grand son should be under the care of a community paediatrician. Are you sure he isn't as referrals to SALT are often triggered by multi disciplinary reviews under the care of paediatrician.

sheramber

Maybe these people can help or offer advice

http://www.ican.org.uk/help

LannieDuck

Are your son and his partner still in a relationship but just living separately? Does your son ever have the child at his house by himself to give the Mum a rest? I'm asking because it sounds as if whoever looks after your grandson full time is probably totally exhausted (as you point out). Babies are very hard work, and he's effectively been at the baby-stage for 4 years, along with poor sleep patterns.

I think you could support both your son and his partner by checking exactly what support they already have in place, and investigating what else might be available. Sure Start centres might be a good place to begin, and there might be some relief care available via the GP. I would have thought that health visitors should already be involved with potty training and nutrition.

Depending on your financial situation, paying for a night nanny for one night a week might be a huge help. It's amazing what a difference a proper nights' sleep can make.

180 miles isn't too bad if trains are direct. Could you afford / is it viable to visit and stay with your son one weekend every couple of months to babysit?

HurdyGurdy

Thank you all for your lovely replies. Sorry I've not replied earlier, but I just quickly wrote/copied the post before going to work this morning.

To clarify a little . . .

My son lives here with us. They have had a "complicated" relationship, but *seem* to have settled down a bit now.

His partner (I'll call her Ann, for ease) was, until his death just before Christmas, virtually the sole carer for her father, which of course further drew on her already depleted energy levels. This was one reason that she wouldn't leave the area she lived in, and move down to where we are. Now that she doesn't have that tie to the area, she is more open to the idea of moving here. That would be brilliant, as she would have support from me and my husband, and my daughter (who is desperate to *be* an auntie to the little man - plus she has worked with SN kids when she was a carer) plus my other son (probably less support from him due to him being young, free and single, and a bit "scared" of kids )

My son has a full time job here, and is able to financially support Ann and their son (I'll call him Johnny, for ease). He has talked about moving up there, but due to their "complicated" relationship, and not much work in the area, thought it was better for him to be financially secure rather than move to where Ann and Johnny live. Right decision? Wrong decision? Who knows. But that is where they are at now.

So my son goes to visit as often as he can get time off work. Which of course means that he isn't really able to form a good bond with Johnny (not able to Skype him etc as Johnny won't interact that way), nor is he able to support Ann.


However, having been in touch with my son during the course of today, it's not as bleak at he made it out to be (desperation at 2.30am, I guess!). Johnny has tried a sausage roll this evening. He spat it straight out, but at least he tried it. He is eating a little bit of chicken, but won't entertain the carrots or pasta. (I tried to say to try small bits of new foods, but not to overwhelm him with too much at once)

Johnny does have an Ed Psych, who has visited him at nursery, and will visit him again there on 18th April. No initial feedback received yet, and she has said she needs to see him a few more times.

He goes to nursery 3 days a week, for 5 hour sessions. Nursery has said they are going to get a dietitian in to review him, and they are going to give (or may be giving already) 1:1 support. It is a mainstream, not special needs, nursery.

He has seen an Ed Psych, a speech therapist, a audiologist and a physical therapist. So actually, there is a really decent package of support in place for the development side of things, which is a huge relief to hear.

So!!

I think what they really want to do now, is get him into a good sleep routine and to vary his diet. Everyone I have spoken to has said that Johnny seems to be displaying ASD traits. He's obviously too young for a formal diagnosis, but IF he is autistic, however mild or serious that may be - can you use the same sleep "training" techniques that you would use on a non ASD child? ie. when they get out of bed, just take them back to bed and not speak to them etc.

and with the eating - just put the food in front of him, and if he doesn't eat it, just take it away without fuss?

I know it's the general feeling that children won't starve themselves, but I don't know if that is the case with ASD, or if they tend to get so "latched onto" one thing that they really would starve if they're not given it.

And what about getting him dressed? He really hates having his clothes put on, although he does keep the clothes on, albeit not with good grace.



Sorry for the extra long post again, and also for not replying to everyone individually. I have read all the replies, and really REALLY appreciate the suggestions and comments.

I have done a bit of googling myself since getting home from work, and have found that they are very lucky, as they do have Sure Start Children's Centres in the area (I know a lot have been closed due to cutbacks) so I have given them the contact details of those, plus given them the contact details for Children's Services in that area so they can see what other support may be available.

HurdyGurdy

Oh, and one thing I would add is that to the best of my knowledge, Johnny was never really socialised as a baby. No parent & toddler groups, no playgroups, no coffee mornings, or "round to a friend's house to play". I haven't really explored this with Ann, as I didn't want it to come across as interfering and accusatory. But that might possibly partly explain why Johnny doesn't interact very much.

Tigsteroonie

HurdyGurdy wrote: »

Johnny has tried a sausage roll this evening. He spat it straight out, but at least he tried it. He is eating a little bit of chicken, but won't entertain the carrots or pasta. (I tried to say to try small bits of new foods, but not to overwhelm him with too much at once)

This is good. Keep re-presenting new foods, just small amounts, a wider diet will come eventually. Our 6yo son's dietitian said that she'd never seen an 11yo eating baby food, so our son would eventually develop wider tastes - which he did, once he started school and saw other children eating a range of food.

He has seen an Ed Psych, a speech therapist, a audiologist and a physical therapist. So actually, there is a really decent package of support in place for the development side of things, which is a huge relief to hear.

Fantastic range of support there. They will decide whether a referral to CAMHS for a formal assessment and potential diagnosis is appropriate.

Everyone I have spoken to has said that Johnny seems to be displaying ADS traits. He's obviously too young for a formal diagnosis,

Not true - they diagnosed our son at 3 years old.

but IF he is autistic, however mild or serious that may be - can you use the same sleep "training" techniques that you would use on a non ASD child? ie. when they get out of bed, just take them back to bed and not speak to them etc.

Believe me, you try all the tricks in the book! Cerebra run a good sleep support service, if you are looking for routes to help.

I know it's the general feeling that children won't starve themselves, but I don't know if that is the case with ASD, or if they tend to get so "latched onto" one thing that they really would starve if they're not given it.

Yes. Autistic children can be incredibly fussy about their food, and would actually starve themselves as they don't necessarily understand that the horrible feeling of hunger will go away if they only ate something.

Pick your battles.

As the Mum to an autistic child with severe learning difficulties, the description of your grandson does set off the "ASD" recognition beacon in my head.

Have you / your family been watching "The A Word" at all? (BBC Monday 9pm) You can find the first two episodes on the iPlayer. I'd recommend watching it - yes, they have taken artistic licence with regards to the time taken to get a diagnosis, it's more like years than days!!, but the character of the Mum being in denial might seem familiar

theoretica

Some kids hate the feeling of clothes - again this can go with ASD, but is by no means confined to it. Looking at soft and non-binding things might help reduce the sensory overload a bit for him, if this is the issue.

peachyprice

TBH, this poor little mite has far more problems for his mum and dad to worry about than his diet. Yes, children need a balanced diet but at his age it's better that he eats something he is comfortable with rather than nothing if he won't eat what they want him to. It might be worth trying to get variety into him through different sources other than 'food' ie smoothies, shakes, purees, preparing other foods into similar shapes and textures. And put new foods with his usual foods not instead of. How is his height/weight? Is he physically where he should be? It really isn't the end of the world if he eats the same dinner every night as long as he is growing normally.

It's extremely common for children with lots of different learning difficulties/ASD to have a problems with food, much of it is a sensory issue, they just don't like anything in their mouth that feels different. My son was 21 this week, he's only just started to eat 'wet' food with any sort of sauce or gravy!

Tigsteroonie

peachyprice wrote: »

My son was 21 this week, he's only just started to eat 'wet' food with any sort of sauce or gravy!

Meh. I'm mid-40s and still don't like gravy :rotfl: :rotfl: