The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

cogito

IveSeenTheLight wrote: »

A little simplistic as they are averages and thus factor in the populations and expenditure.
Of course we could also open up discussion on rurality and access as well.

Of course your point would then indicate that Wales and NI must be vastly in a worse position given their populations in comparison to Scotland.

You do raise an interesting point on population growth, which I have said before is important toward the growth of the Scottish economy, hence why limitations on immigration is viewed differently in Scotland as it is in England.

Your also not debating the fact (other than claiming its easier to manage), which would appear to question the validity of shaka's link stating that All services are worse in Scotland.

Thats just the first one I briefly looked into

The problem for Scotland is that immigrants don't seem to want to go there and becoming independent or even rejoining the EU is unlikely to change that.

Peanuts&Woodstock

I'd accept my Planet Earth passport and I identify with the group called Earthlings, Mother Nature is the leader. While a coalition with Mother Nature and Human Society would have been great she's fighting back now and human society needs to adapt or loose.

sss555s

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Since 1996 Scotland's population has only grown by around 283,000. Somewhat easy to manage.

If England had the same percentage over that time the vote would have been to stay in the EU. You have highlighted one good reason why Scotland staying in the UK is pulling us in the wrong direction.

cogito wrote: »

The problem for Scotland is that immigrants don't seem to want to go there and becoming independent or even rejoining the EU is unlikely to change that.

If the UK are not taking any then there will be more coming to Scotland. I'd say we are closer to the correct balance than England and an independent Scotland would be even better.

TrickyTree83

sss555s wrote: »

If England had the same percentage over that time the vote would have been to stay in the EU. You have highlighted one good reason why Scotland staying in the UK is pulling us in the wrong direction.




If the UK are not taking any then there will be more coming to Scotland. I'd say we are closer to the correct balance than England and an independent Scotland would be even better.

Whether your immigration plan is perfect, worse or better than the UK's. You still have to risk 500,000 jobs instead of 120,000 for independence, you still have to risk 64% of your trade to safeguard 11%.

Independence will not win if it ever gets to the referendum stage.

IveSeenTheLight

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Might be simplistic. The town close to where I live. Is estimated to have grown by 48,000 since 2001. An increase of 26.5% in 16 years. Hardly surprising that there's pressure on local services. A town planners nightmare in fact.

So just under a 1% year on year population growth.
A population of 300,000 averaging an increase of 3,200 people each year.
Remember, not all of these 3,200 people will be using the NHS at the same time

Id suggest that this should be within the realms and capabilities if properly managed.

Looking at the increase in spending over the same period, it would suggest that the increase in spend is proportionally more than the population increase, suggesting that the issue is surrounding the management or cost of that spend.https://www.nuffieldtrust.org.uk/resource/nhs-in-numbers?gclid=CPeg1d7u5NMCFda4GwodLOMITA



This snapshot indicates that efficiency needs to be look at within the NHS as the spend has exceeded the population increase (from your demographic perspective).

Maybe Scotland simply has out performed England in this matter

kabayiri

IveSeenTheLight wrote: »

...

Id suggest that this should be within the realms and capabilities if properly managed.
...

How do you manage something if you can't easily predict upcoming demand?

Imagine an iScotland as part of the EU, coupled with a severe economic crisis in a much larger EU country.

If half a million Spanish/Italian/Polish/whatever turn up in iScotland in just one year, then exactly where does that leave you?

It's easy for Nicola S to be all preachy about immigration given that she hasn't had to face the real challenges it can present on the ground.

TrickyTree83

IveSeenTheLight wrote: »

So just under a 1% year on year population growth.
A population of 300,000 averaging an increase of 3,200 people each year.
Remember, not all of these 3,200 people will be using the NHS at the same time

Id suggest that this should be within the realms and capabilities if properly managed.

Looking at the increase in spending over the same period, it would suggest that the increase in spend is proportionally more than the population increase, suggesting that the issue is surrounding the management or cost of that spend.

This snapshot indicates that efficiency needs to be look at within the NHS as the spend has exceeded the population increase (from your demographic perspective).

Maybe Scotland simply has out performed England in this matter

Using your own charts and knowledge of the public funding gap that exists between England and Scotland it would appear that England is performing better with less per head than Scotland with more per head.

IveSeenTheLight

cogito wrote: »

The problem for Scotland is that immigrants don't seem to want to go there and becoming independent or even rejoining the EU is unlikely to change that.

Maybe a fair point, but maybe also the root cause needs to be identified and diversification of economic opportunities would increase.

Its entirely potential that the policies implemented over the years has attracted more to London and the South East than other areas.

I'm fully confident that Independence will provide the government capability and MP's focus to diversify and grow the Scottish Economic and Population situation.

TrickyTree83

IveSeenTheLight wrote: »

Maybe a fair point, but maybe also the root cause needs to be identified and diversification of economic opportunities would increase.

Its entirely potential that the policies implemented over the years has attracted more to London and the South East than other areas.

I'm fully confident that Independence will provide the government capability and MP's focus to diversify and grow the Scottish Economic and Population situation.

Is that during of after you've lost most of those 500,000 jobs?

cogito

sss555s wrote: »

If the UK are not taking any then there will be more coming to Scotland.

Non sequitur.