The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

.string.

elantan wrote: »

Well I do believe the behaviour of people in George Square on 19th September 2014 is a worry ... and I do worry that when we get indy these people come back to the foreground of Scotland's society as they won't be able to accept defeat

But I think we will be OK ... we managed well the last time no one was murdered unlike in Brexit ... I would truly like to think we're a bit more mature than that ... although when I saw the video of the man with the English accent share his bile about the people of Scotland I was rather surprised ... and when I read all the people that want Sturgeon hung etc I do worry that this time the Brit Nats will be so scared of losing they become violent ...

I'm also hoping it's Yes party central again a lot this time as I intend on doing the partying this time around and not the campaigning ... I'm hoping the parties will be even better

Let me ask you though ... do you think we shouldn't seek to have self governance because of your fears ?

I'm disappointed you did not follow my lead of not assigning blame in my question which was about whether a referendum at this time would worsen social division in Scotland.

Anyway, consequences of social strife are but one aspect of a complex decision​. They would not be the (single) reason for a choice either way.

elantan

I'm not really assigning blame though am I ? I said I think we will be OK

TrickyTree83

elantan wrote: »

I'm not really assigning blame though am I ?

It looked/read pretty one sided to me to be honest.

Shaka_Zulu

Excellent news!

Ruth Davidson 6/1 favourite to be next First Minister.

That will cause a bit of spluttering in SNP circles. I guess they could always put their money where their mouths are and back their man/woman to put right this affront :rotfl:

https://sports.ladbrokes.com/en-gb/betting/politics/british/next-first-minister/next-scottish-first-minister/223105584/

NCC-1701

elantan wrote: »

I'm not really assigning blame though am I ? I said I think we will be OK

For balance why not give examples of what 'Yes' voters did that you found unacceptable? The treatment of Eddie Izzard perhaps by the former SNP members....who were former members why?

elantan

TrickyTree83 wrote: »

It looked/read pretty one sided to me to be honest.

Well it would to you obviously

elantan

NCC-1701 wrote: »

For balance why not give examples of what 'Yes' voters did that you found unacceptable? The treatment of Eddie Izzard perhaps by the former SNP members....who were former members why?

Is that the one where Eddie Izzard said he wasn't attacked and it was a media set up ?

TrickyTree83

Right then.

This is in particular for indy supporters who have engaged with me on the economics of an independent Scotland, can you tell me if this meme is accurate?



We all know if you've read my posts where those statistics come from.

Lets walk through them.

1. 80,000 jobs will be cut.

- well apparently at risk now means cut to Business for Scotland, given the 80,000 figure came from the Fraser of Allander institute which produced the figure of 1,000,000 jobs at risk from independence we can safely say that Business for Scotland would also think that would be 1,000,000 jobs cut as a result of independence.

2. Scotland's economic growth will be cut by £8bn.

- astoundingly close to the Barnett figure that is. So cutting Barnett isn't a problem but cutting £8bn of economic growth is?

3. Real wages will fall by £2,000 per person per year.

- holy crap, that means someone on £20,000 per year before we leave the EU will be paid £0 per year after just 10 years since leaving the EU!! That's really low brow marketing skill. It's obviously not per person per year, if I'm being generous I assume they're talking about deflation of currency and decreased wage rises. Well we've had wage stagnation under the EU for the best part of a decade if not more and deflation as a result of Brexit is minimal compared to the deflation required under Scotland's very own currency to stay afloat, assuming of course that tax rises are politically inconvenient along with spending cuts.

4. Exports will be cut by 11%.

- well clearly this is referring to the proportion of trade that Scotland does with the EU, yet I distinctly recall being told on here by certain people that "no one seriously thinks that all trade will be lost", because if that were the case then my word it makes absolute sense to stay in the union where 64% of Scottish exports are sent.

5. Scotland's debt will increase by £10bn over 5 years to pay for the Brexit Scotland voted against.

- Lets do the maths, £10bn over 5 years works out at £2bn per year. Well if Scotland were to leave the union and lose 1,000,000 jobs and lose 64% of it's trade in line with your OTHER claims Business for Scotland then I sure as hell think £2bn per year over 10 years is a safer option than absolute and utter destitution. Plus, given the deficit I think you'll find it'll increase by more than just the £2bn, but inside the union you don't have to worry about that. Being independent, it's more than just £2bn you need to worry about, all of this assuming you're correct (which you're probably not).

I should just point out that only points 1 and 2 have referable sources to check the claims against.

This utter hogwash from Business for Scotland immediately makes it clear this is not from businesses in Scotland but a political activist group, maybe loosely connected to business, who knows. But they sure as hell don't tell the truth.

Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you, pro-Scottish independence propaganda that looks as though it was put together by a low grade volunteer student. None of it has been checked or validated for internal consistency, it's a complete waste of time and a complete joke. If this is the level of campaigning the Unionists have to worry about there's no point in having another referendum as you'll likely end up moving the needle in the opposite direction.

https://twitter.com/Uppington/status/842478075510226944

ProDave

Can one of the yes supporters please explain this:

In 2014, the SNP told us, this was a once in a generation referendum. Fine. We all accepted that, we had our vote, and remain won.

So why should anybody be ion the least bit surprised when we are told it is simply too soon to have another referendum. Clearly 4 years is not a "generation"

So what makes the SNP even begin to think the time is right now? or were they lying in 2014 when they said it was once in a generation?

NCC-1701

elantan wrote: »

Is that the one where Eddie Izzard said he wasn't attacked and it was a media set up ?

I don't know...do you? Link? Any other specific 'Yes' attack you are willing to condemn? I used the EI incident as an example...or you saying all the vitriol from the 'yes' voters was staged?