Is section 21 valid if Landlord hadn't signed Tenancy agreement?

Coastfodder

Hi everyone,

We have been served a Section 21 by the agent for our Landlord & noticed that the Landlord didn't sign the tenancy agreement and the agent also doesn't have a signed copy.


Also, there are several points that the Landlord didn't fulfill their obligations, even the agent has tried in vain to get the landlord to complete required repairs. Instead of doing repairs our landlord wants us too leave :-(

dancingfairy

If the tenancy agreement is unsigned I think a judge would probably rule it as valid. You've been in the property and have, I assume consistently paid rent. You probably can't now turn around and say its not valid. That's not to say its not poor practice/ sloppy housekeeping though.
In terms of complaining if the repairs aren't done, that is certainly your right. I'm not sure but there was some talk of landlords not being able to serve notice in tenants if they complained but I'm not sure if this has come into force yet.
Im sure other will be along who know the ins and outs better than me but you would probably find it helpful to check out the charity shelter's website and/ or give them a call.
Df

dancingfairy

Ignore my post. I misread it that you were trying to prove the tenancy wasn't valid, not the section 21.
For some reason I am unable to delete my post.
Do check out the shelter website/ call them though.
Df

thesaint

An unsigned tenancy agreement does not have any effect upon a Sec 21.

[Deleted User]

Dates are more important, when did you move in, how long was the tenancy for, is the fixed period over yet, what is the date noted on the S21 as to when you are supposed to leave?

Once that date is up (its just a notice to quit), the LL then has to go to court and get a possession order, then a bailiffs warrant. Only when he has these do you HAVE to leave the property. You will have to pay the court costs for these (£280 + £110).

Any delay you try to introduce through the S21 is only a delay, he's going for a no fault conviction and he will get you evicted eventually while your court costs are going up and up.

Its not right, but I'm afraid you persist in trying to get repairs done, then you increase the chances of getting a S21 and being evicted eventually. There is no protection for tenancies that are already in place.

If the repairs are serious enough, get environmental health involved so the LL HAS to make the repairs. This could affect any reference he gives you though (tell him you won't be able to leave easily if he gives you a bad reference).

Pixie5740

Dates and deposit protection are more important when it comes to issuing a valid Section 21. There is no defence against a correctly issued Section 21 though so even if your landlord gets it wrong first time then sooner or later he will get you out of the property. The only control you really have is whether you go the easy way or the hard way and whilst the hard way might be tempting it can leave you seriously out of pocket and give you stress you just don't need in your life.

The good news is that with any new AST you sign you will be (somewhat) protected from retaliatory Section 21s if you request repairs to be carried out thanks to the Deregulation Act.

kinger101

Although it's advisable to have tenancy agreements signed, not having a signature is of little consequence. The fact that you've been paying money to live somewhere indicates the tenancy is in place. And what other terms could there have possible been other than your (unsigned) tenancy agreement?

The repairs are of little relevance.

However, the S21 notice does need to be valid;

http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/content/check-list-serving-valid-section-21-notice

Guest101

A LL doesn't need to sign a tenancy agreement as he is presenting it. He's deemed to have accepted the terms as he prepared it ( in theory anyway ).

It's useful to have so you can sue for any breaches, but a court would more often than not simply presume that in any case the LL agreed to the terms.

theartfullodger

Since a tenancy agreement for less than 3 years does not even need to be in writing no, of course not.

Did an agent sign it?

G_M

A written tenancy agreement is not required for a tenancy to exist.

Therefore the presence or absence of a signature has no bearing on the validity of a S21 Notice.

always_sunny

Pixie5740 wrote: »

... The only control you really have is whether you go the easy way or the hard way...

just curious really, but going the hard way wouldn't make it difficult to rent in the future?